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Off Topic and Controversial

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FastLearner
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Joined: 12/31/1969

FYI, I've asked Nando via IM if he'd be willing to remove his tangent from the end of this post: http://www.bgdf.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=22282#22280

I noted that removal wasn't mandatory, but that I'd rather he did to avoid any trouble. No response yet, but his presence in the IM list may have been an artifact after he already left.

I really wavered on how to put the request, or whether to even make it a request. How do you guys feel about this kind of stuff on the board?

-- Matthew

jwarrend
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Joined: 08/03/2008
Off Topic and Controversial

Hey, no fair! He complied with your request before I could read the controversial bit!

Oh well, no controversy for me to enjoy, I guess. Glad it appears to have worked itself ok. Nando seems like a pretty good guy in general, so I'm not surprised he acquiesced.

-Jeff

FastLearner
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Off Topic and Controversial

Oops, didn't think about him editing before y'all saw it.

It was just a very short rant, enclosed in tags, where he indicates that there's a huge amount of Christian-bashing going on now and that such a game might not even be allowed in stores because it might offend athiests or Muslims (stated faceitiously, I think).

Not a huge deal, but the fact that I had an instant gut reaction and wanted to respond in a way that, while polite, probably would have only fanned the flames, made me think the post (and the board) might be better without it.

-- Matthew

jwarrend
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Off Topic and Controversial

Heh, I actually agree with Nando's basic premise -- there is a ton of Christian-bashing going on in the media right now, no question about it. (whether we Christians caused it, or deserve it, or any of that is beyond the scope of what I'm saying, but it's definitely happening). However, I don't think that really pertains to game sales, or to board games in general. Not having read Nando's comments, not sure where they fell on the spectrum, but I agree that we should be careful not to give too much free rein for off topic posts of any variety. But we also should recognize that we are a community and that off topic stuff is going to come up naturally from time to time in the flow of conversations, so we should try to be somewhat flexible when the situation warrants or permits it.

-Jeff

FastLearner
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Off Topic and Controversial

I don't disagree that off-topic posts are normal. I just believe that discussions about religion and politics are almost never going to be necessary here, and so should be avoided.

And for what it's surely not worth, my take is that any rise in Christian bashing is directly related to the rise in Christian power in our culture: the two almost always go together (power and bashing).

-- Matthew

Scurra
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Off Topic and Controversial

Yup, nix all the religion and politics stuff asap.

(Can I stick my oar in here however and observe that this is also an international forum? Different countries have very different experiences of this sort of thing, and it's easy to forget that others may not be able to directly relate to things like this. I have a similar problem, in that I live in London in the UK, and frankly Londoners tend to think that the world (let alone the UK!) revolves around them... ;-)

Brykovian
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Off Topic and Controversial

Scurra wrote:
observe that this is also an international forum ... ;-)

Who let the Brit in here? ;-D

-Bryk

j/k ... I have nothing of value to add ... but what's new, eh?

FastLearner
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Off Topic and Controversial

The fact that it's an international forum makes it even more important to avoid religion and politics, from my perspective, since something that sounds perfectly harmless in one place might be incredibly rude in another (I've witnessed such in other international forums).

Which probably puts us on the same page. :)

-- Matthew

jwarrend
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Joined: 08/03/2008
Off Topic and Controversial

FastLearner wrote:
I don't disagree that off-topic posts are normal. I just believe that discussions about religion and politics are almost never going to be necessary here, and so should be avoided.

I agree, there's no surer way to initiate a flamewar than to spark a discussion about religion or politics.

Speaking only for myself, though, I actually prefer a fleshed-out exposition of someone's views than the offhand comments that people make. (I'm not speaking about BGDF specifically here, just in conversations in general). I can't stand it when people make remarks that don't thoughtfully express a position, but just assume that everyone in the room already espouses it. In that sense, I prefer 10 off topic posts to one short undefended assertion. But of course, if we could have neither, that would be best.

Quote:

And for what it's surely not worth, my take is that any rise in Christian bashing is directly related to the rise in Christian power in our culture: the two almost always go together (power and bashing).

I agree that there's certainly a correlation; whether or not there's justification is a matter that I assume goes beyond the scope of the discussion. My unsolicited opinion on this subject is that I get frustrated when commentators project maliciousness onto Christians rather than trying to understand where they're coming from. Take abortion (let's just go for the most controversial possible example!) -- I think it's unfair and disingenuous to represent Christians as seeking, as a primary motivator, to clamp down on women's freedoms. The bottom line is, pro-life Christians think that it's a little baby. That's all there is to it. I think it's legitimate to disagree about that, but I don't like how Christians who are pro-life are labeled as bigots or oppressors simply for having a point of view. So that's what I find troublesome, that much of the bashing occurs from, as I see it, a position that lacks understanding about why Christians seek certain things.

Anyway, I hope I expressed that in a non-controversial enough way. But since it's OT, I'd better let that be my last word on the subject!

-Jeff

sedjtroll
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Joined: 07/21/2008
Off Topic and Controversial

FastLearner wrote:
... the two almost always go together (power and bashing).

What do you know, a built-in 'bash the leader' problem! Who designed this world anyway?

All kidding aside, I guess I missed this whol 'controversy'. I don't look at it as losing a controversy, but as gaining a brother-in-law.

I do however have 1 thing to add that might be important to note:

I didn't read the post so I don't know what it was about, but Nando is a really great guy and I chat with him daily in the chat room. It's no suprise to me that he complied with Matthew's request immediately, and for what it's worth I think that request was probably the way to go - even though my initial thoughts when I read Matthew's post included the words "censorship" "babysitting" and "sugar coating". After a little more thought I agree that the forum would be better without lengthy debates on Religion, Politics, and Morality.

- Seth

phpbbadmin
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Joined: 04/23/2013
Off Topic and Controversial

sedjtroll wrote:

I didn't read the post so I don't know what it was about, but Nando is a really great guy and I chat with him daily in the chat room. It's no suprise to me that he complied with Matthew's request immediately,

- Seth

Agreed. Nando is an upstanding fellow. I wish we had more members like him. And I also agree that political/religious stuff doesn't need to be here.

-M

FastLearner
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Off Topic and Controversial

Just to clarify, I completely agree that Nando is a very cool guy. In fact, I'm sure that's why I just requested he change it, and said he could leave it if it was imporant enough to him.

I imagine if it had been, say, Lee (VeritasGames), I probably would have edited the message myself and sent him a stern PM. But that's the kind of unfair dick I can be, sometimes. ;)

-- Matthew

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