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Is game mechanics copyrightable?

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Anonymous

Hi all,
I have a question about copyright. I know that title of the game and brand are copyrightable, i.e. I can't start selling my copies of e.g. UNO. But what about game mechanics? Can I for example create a game called e.g. Bang (or some other name that is not protected), which has EXACTLY same rules as UNO has, but only players need to scream Bang instead of UNO?

Regards,
ddt

zaiga
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

The short answer is that game mechanics cannot be copyrighted. So, yes, it would be legal to create a game that has the same mechanics as "Uno". In fact, "Uno" is derived from a traditional card game, so it's not like it is exactly an original idea in the first place.

That said, "Wizards of the Coast" has patented some elements of a trading card game. In short, you cannot make a trading card game in which the object is to lower your opponents "life resource" from Y to X AND in which you "tap" cards to activate them. Neither may you use the terms "graveyard" for a discard pile or "library" for the draw pile.

Hope this helps.

- René Wiersma

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Thanks for the reply, that is what I thought, but I wasn't sure ...

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

You can copyright your rules and visual pieces (cards, game board), but not the name or branding. The name would need to be protected by a trademark, which is very different from a copyright.

You also need to be careful not to copy the specific rules of another game too closely, or you may be infringing upon their copyright. With the Uno example, you would be free to make a game based on the concept and system of crazy eights (which is in the public domain). Just don't go too far beyond it in the same direction as Uno (using cards specific to Uno like "Wild Draw Four" etc.).

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Hmm .. now I'm not sure that you're right ... I had those "specific rules" in mind ... and I took UNO just as an example ... I concluded that nothing can prevent me from re-doing a dungeon crawling game like e.g. Drakon with e.g. rescuing theme, so instead of Dragon I'd have some super rescue hero and instead of gold tokens I can have tiles with people in danger ... and I assume that I can still copy each and every Drakon tile with all their specific icons/actions ... so, am I assuming right or not?

jwarrend
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Joined: 08/03/2008
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

This is the second post we've had recently on this subject, and even though I think you're speaking hypothetically, it worries me enough that I want to chime in. (Note: I'm speaking only for myself here, and not as a representative of the site).

ddt wrote:
Hmm .. now I'm not sure that you're right ... I had those "specific rules" in mind ... and I took UNO just as an example ... I concluded that nothing can prevent me from re-doing a dungeon crawling game like e.g. Drakon with e.g. rescuing theme, so instead of Dragon I'd have some super rescue hero and instead of gold tokens I can have tiles with people in danger ...

Nothing, of course, except a basic sense of decency, fair play, respect for others, etc. It's probably true that what you're proposing, and what the other poster in the "Settlers" thread proposed, is within the guidelines, strictly speaking, of legality. But I have to say that as a designer, I consider doing something like this to be pathetic, dishonest, and unethical. Someone else spent time designing and developing a game, and has a right to benefit from their idea. I have no problem with you licensing their design, changing it, and selling it with a new theme. But ripping off their idea, switching the "chrome", and selling it as your own is lame beyond lame. Moreover, this will certainly get caught: gamers will immediately recognize that your game has been ripped off, and will shun the game. I believe this has happened in the past; I can try to find the reference if you'd like.

Now, let me qualify this a bit: the idea of borrowing mechanics is well-established, and, as games like Puerto Rico prove, a valid way to take existing ideas and make a completely different game experience out of it. I have no problem with that. And as I said, I have no problem with someone licensing an existing game and rereleasing it with changes. What I'm objecting to is specifically the idea of taking an entire game system, and not giving the original designer his due for having come up with the idea.

Quote:

and I assume that I can still copy each and every Drakon tile with all their specific icons/actions ... so, am I assuming right or not?

Here, I think you're on shakier ground. I think that the images, rulebook, etc, are copyrighted. If you changed the images and components, you'd probably be ok legally, but ethically, I don't think you would be. Sorry to come down hard on you, but I think it's important for we who take this craft seriously to set a high standard of ethics. Someone who just wants to make a quick buck may not feel a need to adhere to such a code, but on this site, I'm not going to pretend to have any respect for an unscrupulous quick-buck-maker just to play nicey-nice.

-Jeff

prophx
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Joined: 08/13/2008
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

For a few examples of newly published games that are very similar to ones we grew up with, check out Fundex who has games very similar to Battleship (Sea Battle), Operation (Monster Medic), Scrabble (Words, Words, Words), Twister (Tied in Knots), Connect-4 (Four In A Row). They call them Value Games.

http://www.fundexgames.com/products/?p=1

For the most part they are just repackaged games with a little different imagery on the same game.

Thought I'd throw these in here for examples...

Rob

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

OK, I guess I need to give a little explanations now ;) .. First, I didn't meant to literally photocopy all tiles, I meant to ask about using the same action and similar icons ...
I found yesterday on a boardgamegeek a list of games that are in the public domain ... and that triggered the question, because I was sure that I read somewhere that name can be protected via trade mark, but that game mechanics can't ... That's why I posted the question in the first place ... I remember seeing a picture of patent registration for Magic the gathering in one of the Levy's book about inventors, but I thought that he wasn't right completely because there are so many TCG's now with very similar mechanics like magic ... then zaiga posted info about Magic being not 100% protected ... then I posted my old idea about rescue crawling game which I planned to do in similar fashion like Drakon and other crawling games but with different tiles and rules ... it's easy to add a couple of pieces to the game and to add some rule changes ... but I wanted to ask about legality of realy copying the whole mechanics, each tile even, because who can tell where the line between game similarity should be drawn ...

Now, let's assume that dominoes are not in the public domain ... and I want to make a Disney version of dominoes with disney characters instead of matching numbers ... dominoes rules are so simple, I mean it's 1 line ... would it be unfair to do the disney version? Or I'd need to reconstruct domino tiles into some Tetris like shapes, so no one can be upset with my change ...

prophx
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Joined: 08/13/2008
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

I think I still have my Disney dominoes somewhere... probably at my mom's. They were plastic, light blue dominoes with character stickers in the cubes. You match character faces. Thanks for the memory!

Rob

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

ddt wrote:
...with different tiles and rules...

I think the scope of what you're trying to do and the degree to which it is acceptable (at least in my eyes and very likely others on this site) depends on your treatment of the game.

jwarrend wrote:
...the idea of borrowing mechanics is well-established, and, as games like Puerto Rico prove, a valid way to take existing ideas and make a completely different game experience out of it.

There is a vast difference between borrowing a mechanic here and there and wholesale lifting of another designer's game design. Think of it as a recipe. Lots of recipes have onions in them, but that doesn't make them the same. Each has its own flavor and texture. Yes, presentation is important, but you can't just take someone else's soup, put it into a new bowl and call it your soup. You can freely use ingredients found in other games, just make them your own. Find unique ways to incorporate them.

You mention both that you want to incoporate various mechanics from a variety of games into your own game, and also that you want to "copy whole mechanics, each tile even..." I don't have a problem with the first so long as you make the game your own. Use a mechanic here and there, but put them together in a way that gives a new gaming experience. Bravo and good luck to you to that end.

The other, however I cannot condone. Like others, I would disuade you from lifting a completed game from someone else and slapping your own theme or designs onto them. Depending on the game, you may be in legal trouble for doing so. Copyrights protect the method of doing something. If your rules are demonstrably close to pre-existing game (irregardless of the theme or icons), you could find yourself in legal hot water.

It is always better to make your own game. Use mechanics that you like from different games, but use them sparingly and make them your own.

OldScratch
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Not sure if I'm going on a tangent here or saying somethign someone else has said, but...

I'm not sure that copyright protects how you play the game. Rather, it protects the literary printed work of your rules, so basically the only thing you can't do is plagiarize the rules. If it's a totally original idea you're putting in your game, you can trademark it as part of your game. So in essence, yes, you could actually take Monopoly, change the board, change every bit of artwork, use different tokens, call it a different name, and you'd probably be in the clear. But if you took their rule book, copied it word for word except for the parts that you changed (changed Hotel to Palace, for instance), then you'd probably get a lawsuit cause you copied copyrighted material there.

You can't copyright the way a game's played, but you can trademark it if it's pretty original, I think. However, if you're planning on making a game and pretty much copying another game and adding a few other things, first of all, will you actually be going through with this? Investing thousands of dollars? If you want to get it published by a publisher, do you think they'll take a game that's such a ripoff of the original? If you plan on self-publishing, do you think you could compete with the big boys? Why would people buy your game instead of theirs? I don't think it's a good idea. The farthest you'll probably go with this idea is just making the game as a hobby, because unless the game isn't something someone's done before, and it's fun and nice looking, no publisher's gonna want to take it.

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Well, first of all, I haven't said that I plan to copy any game, all questions were hypothetical ... I said that I had an idea about rescuing game using dungeon crawling mechanics and nothing else ... All questions were triggered because of the list of games in public domain, which I understand as meaning that anybody can print those games with exactly same rules and with exactly same name (chess, dominoes and such) ... and then I simply asked about game mechanics copyright ... so, I guess, no one knows for sure whether game mechanics can be copied or not ... I agree with last poster that it would be stupid to simply lift all rules and re-theme it, although the result can be much better then original, i.e. if original game was targeted to very narrow gropu of people (gothinc theme, nerd theme or something similar) and someone sees the possibility to apply same rules to some other common theme ...

Scurra
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Joined: 09/11/2008
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

ddt wrote:
... so, I guess, no one knows for sure whether game mechanics can be copied or not ....

I thought the replies seemed pretty clear: we know for sure that you can't copyright game mechanics.
What makes a game however is the interaction of different mechanics within the game - look on the 'geek, and you'll see that almost all games are classified under several different mechanics, and if they could be copyrighted then those lists would be very short :-)

So your hypothetical "Disney dominoes" would be perfectly OK from a game point of view; of course Disney would sue your ass off, but that's a different problem...

And retheming has also been done with great success, but in most cases it has been done with the co-operation of the original game designer. That doesn't mean that people haven't made their own "home-brew" variants of existing games (the first game I made when I was a kid was a localised version of Monopoly, and this would be years before that concept became commonplace) but no-one expects them to be commercial possibilities.

In the end, what matters is the new, interesting and/or different things that a design contains - if it's a mixture of established mechanics then no-one will complain if they work well together.

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Scurra wrote:
That doesn't mean that people haven't made their own "home-brew" variants of existing games (the first game I made when I was a kid was a localised version of Monopoly, and this would be years before that concept became commonplace) but no-one expects them to be commercial possibilities.

Interestingly, Monopoly started as localised versions, with players visiting friends in other cities and then re-theming it when they drew their own board to use at home. It just got locked down when Darrow "his idea" to Parkers.

I recently saw a c.1900 copy from Delhi, which seems to have been done by an individual after trying the game in America.

Scurra
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Is game mechanics copyrightable?

I suppose I should have said "commercially commonplace" really (and I'm referring to post-Darrow versions anyway.). When did the London version come out initially, I wonder?

OldScratch
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

ddt wrote:
Well, first of all, I haven't said that I plan to copy any game, all questions were hypothetical ... I said that I had an idea about rescuing game using dungeon crawling mechanics and nothing else ... All questions were triggered because of the list of games in public domain, which I understand as meaning that anybody can print those games with exactly same rules and with exactly same name (chess, dominoes and such) ... and then I simply asked about game mechanics copyright ... so, I guess, no one knows for sure whether game mechanics can be copied or not ... I agree with last poster that it would be stupid to simply lift all rules and re-theme it, although the result can be much better then original, i.e. if original game was targeted to very narrow gropu of people (gothinc theme, nerd theme or something similar) and someone sees the possibility to apply same rules to some other common theme ...

So basically you're asking, then, if you could simply use another simple game mechanic, not rule or overall gameplay, to use in your game? If that's your question then yes, you can. In the simplest of terms, rolling a six sided die to move your pawn across a board is not a copyrighted game mechanic. If that's how you want players to move on your board in your game, use it. If you want someone to 'attack' another player and roll as many dice as his weapon accounts for, yes, you can use that. Even if you get into more specific details about the mechanic, such as if all the numbers on the die represented a unique outcome or situation, you could take that too and use it.

I think to make this topic a little clearer, you shouldn't post hypothetical questions, but post more questions that actually relate to the game you're making. You've said the game you're borrowing mechanics from (I think) but you haven't said which mechanics would be used and/or borrowed. I think many people here would be able to better answer your questions if you were to get into the specifics a little bit more.

Anonymous
Is game mechanics copyrightable?

Scurra wrote:
I suppose I should have said "commercially commonplace" really

Yes, I wasn't seriously challenging your point, just musing on a pet interest... :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly_(game)#London_version for info. on the history of the British (London) edition.

Richard.

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