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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

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Thu, 12/02/2004 - 19:09
simonh
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Joined: 12/31/1969

Earlier this year I put togther and refined a prototype card game. After contacting a number of game publishers, one wrote back saying they were interested in the description of my game, could I send photos and rules. Hey! I was excited, got some photos emailed out to them, and worked on putting the rules into a doc. As we exchanged emails over the next few weeks the publisher asked if I could send prototype cards for them to playtest. More excitement. Got the cards put together (graphics designed on PC, printed, laminated - a nice card set). Put a hard copy of the rules, and the cards, and a scorepad in the mail. A few days later the publisher confirmed by email that the prototype package had been received.

Ok. That was September 2nd. I haven't heard a peep from them in 3 months. I did send a couple of tentative enquiries (no more than once a month) but got no response.

My question is, do I just hold on and let them get back to me as and when they can, without kicking up a fuss? I'm inclined to do this at present, having got the general impression from reading other threads here that actually getting a prototype into the publisher's hands is quite an achievement in itself. But how long is too long? I'm assuming that it is bad form to approach other companies with my design while it is being evaluated by this one company.

Your thoughts and perspectives on this are appreciated.

Regards,
~Simon

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Thu, 12/02/2004 - 19:52
#1
GeminiWeb
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Simon,

I seem to be paralleling your own experiences to date, with a request for a prototype from a publisher for my first game about mid-September. However, I've been a bit luckier in being able to maintan a dialogue with the publisher (who has been very polite and friendly).

In my case, things slowed down with the publisher having to stop everything to prepare for Essen, only to come back with Christmas around the corner.

That said, since asking a couple of days ago, I now know its been playtested a couple of times, with some favourable feedback, and a few issues which require some further playtesting to explore further.

As such, everything might be okay and they've been a bit busy to get their playtesters together, but its worth asking the publisher if there's been any feedback on the playtesting of your game.

- Bill

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Fri, 12/03/2004 - 03:29
#2
gamemaker-KD
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Ahoy there simonh, we do deal in a lot of trust as inventors when we put our game out there.You didn't mention if you sign a submission form or not. But you did get e-mail saying they got your game, so thats a good thing. this time of year is very busy so the next time you try contacting them (hopefully by phone) say that you know how busy holiday season can get and ask if the play testing will be done before or after the new year. Somebody (and all its takes is one) there likes your game so hang in there. try not to make a fuss, and don't send your game to another company. That's a no no. I've waited up to five months once. If you feel good about this company and their product line give it some more time. OK thats all for now, let us know how things go. GOOD LUCK

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Fri, 12/03/2004 - 10:43
#3
Joe_Huber
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Actually, I've heard a number of designers extolling simultaneous submissions. I've never tried it, but that's just because it would too much of a headache...

The longest a publisher has held one of my games is 21 months. I do believe it's fine to send a quick note (email or otherwise) asking if there's any news. And of course it's fine to ask for an answer or the return of your game - but the later is of course the most likely answer.

Joe

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Fri, 12/03/2004 - 13:16
#4
Scurra
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Joe_Huber wrote:
Actually, I've heard a number of designers extolling simultaneous submissions. I've never tried it, but that's just because it would too much of a headache...

Mind you, some publishers specifically state that they won't consider "simultaneous submissions". I can see why they would have this policy, but it can lead to problems if they don't give some idea of their typical consideration time too, so you know how long you are going to be hanging on...

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Fri, 12/03/2004 - 18:03
#5
simonh
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

gamemaker-KD wrote:
Somebody (and all its takes is one) there likes your game so hang in there. try not to make a fuss, and don't send your game to another company. That's a no no. I've waited up to five months once. If you feel good about this company and their product line give it some more time.

Well, the company is Mayfair and, taking other developers' experiences into account, I'm definitely willing to give them more time. I feel pretty good that one of the "Big Boys" has shown an interest in my game - the initial email correspondence exchanged with Mayfair was definitely positive. Hearing that waiting months is not unusual, makes me feel better about the situation.

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Sun, 12/05/2004 - 13:02
#6
Dralius
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Don’t get discouraged if you have to wait it is a busy time of year in the toy and game industry. Two major events The Chicago Toy and Game Fair and Essen keep these people well booked and then of course there are holiday sales to keep up with. The game editor is most likely spending a lot of time at these show checking out the competition so they can decide what they are going to produce. Then on top of all that they have to try to have a personal life. If you don’t hear from them until the New Year don’t worry.

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Mon, 12/06/2004 - 03:20
#7
Anonymous
Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Simonh, it is very difficult to be sure what a business does. If the property was unsolicited than you know the producer has to examine many details, the cost to produce, the legal aspects, the distribution, the potential for success, and the best marketing approach. Like everyone else they probably put in a 10 hour day and are uncertain why they need to look at your concept.

If the property was unsolicited, you have to convince them that any money and time they put into "your" concept is going to result in more profit than any other unsolicited concept they have looked at, are looking at or will look at. Big business has limited capital and is slow to venture it on new ideas. They don't like to have their people wasting time on projects that are going nowhere and it's not easy for the marketing people in these companies to be certain either way, if a new idea is going to get them fired or promoted. Mostly it's best to do nothing until someone higher up says " run with this idea".

If your intellectual property was solicited then you can be certain they are looking at it. Most often they will issue you a standard form upon which you will sign away your rights to just about everything under the premiss that the staff of the particular business is trustworthy. Under these scenarios, after a few days or weeks you will get a reply indicating that they are not interested or that they want more information. This can drag on for months and eventually you will hear nothing. This is because you have not actually sold them your idea. Time has allowed the "newness" and "thrill" of your concept to fade and they are looking at it with jaded eyes. Most times you wont hear much more unless you kick start the process with more "thrill" and get them excited about your idea again.

However, the business may be looking for the right time to move this into the market. They may be looking at other artists, they may be training new people, they may be looking at new distribution methods or waiting for feedback from busy sales reps, they may have too much existing work, they may be low on development capital and waiting for next year.

The list is endless but one thing stands out in all this confusion. If you want something move yourself before it's gone. Those that hesitate lose. It's the same for business. If the business does not care about the competition getting your IP first, than they really are not very interested are they.

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Mon, 12/06/2004 - 08:13
#8
jwarrend
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

I certainly don't have any experience in this area that would lend any kind of help, but I have to say that just from a standpoint of basic human courtesy, their lack of a response to you is troubling. I understand that they're busy, and I don't think it's unreasonable for them to take a good amount of time to evaluate your design, but I'd be very bothered if a very reasonable request for an update on a once-per-month basis (which I think is about as non-pushy as one could be) goes ignored. I find this kind of conduct deplorable in all arenas in which it occurs -- not just the game submission process. No one is too busy to provide you with a quick response of "still working on it, we'll let you know".

I don't know that there's anything I would actually do, if I were you; this is Mayfair, after all, and you don't want to jeapordize a chance at getting a game published through them. Or maybe you do? Mayfair, or any publisher, isn't doing you a favor by publishing your game -- they're entering into a business arrangement for which they stand to gain far more than you will (although they incur more risk, so it's not an unfair arrangement). Furthermore, they, like any publisher, are only as good as the games they put out. Without games, like yours, they'd quickly fade into obscurity. So, if you feel that they are behaving in an unprofessional or unacceptable manner, pull your design, or shop it around to someone else. There are other publishers out there, and no publisher is so great that you should allow yourself to be abused.

Now, I don't know if the current situation qualifies as crossing this kind of a line. Just saying that a company that can't even demonstrate a modicum of basic human courtesy would be someone I'd be hesistant to work with. Unless I thought I had a game that they'd actually publish...

Good luck, and hang in there!

-Jeff

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Tue, 12/14/2004 - 22:52
#9
simonh
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An answer soon

A quick note.. I just had an email from Mayfair. As suspected, the demands of the holiday season had kept them busy. They hope to come to a decision about my game design by the end of the year.

Watch this space....

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Wed, 12/15/2004 - 15:25
#10
Anonymous
Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Great opportunity for you! Not surprising that the holiday season is crunch time for them, as it is for every major industry (we're trying to get everything out teh door that must be billed before year end). At least they did get back to you, and with the promise of an answer in the next few weeks! Congratulations and best of luck!

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Fri, 12/31/2004 - 15:37
#11
boardgamegeezer
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Months

After submitting your game for appraisal you could wait months 7, 9, 10 months before they get back to you. Especially the big players.
Even then it can take one two years before they publish the game preparing etc.
This is from the moputh of my game development company in UK which are very well known with the board game and toy companies.
Aint fair is it?

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Sat, 01/01/2005 - 15:10
#12
zaiga
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Re: Months

boardgamegeezer wrote:
After submitting your game for appraisal you could wait months 7, 9, 10 months before they get back to you. Especially the big players.
Even then it can take one two years before they publish the game preparing etc.
This is from the moputh of my game development company in UK which are very well known with the board game and toy companies.
Aint fair is it?

By any chance, is your game development company Gamesplay UK? If so, you might want to read this thread.

- René Wiersma

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Thu, 01/06/2005 - 20:07
#13
simonh
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Another Brief Update

Heard back from Mayfair again. My game is still under consideration and will be undergoing more play testing.

Watch this space.

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Fri, 01/07/2005 - 13:55
#14
boardgamegeezer
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Re: Months

zaiga wrote:
boardgamegeezer wrote:
After submitting your game for appraisal you could wait months 7, 9, 10 months before they get back to you. Especially the big players.
Even then it can take one two years before they publish the game preparing etc.
This is from the moputh of my game development company in UK which are very well known with the board game and toy companies.
Aint fair is it?

By any chance, is your game development company Gamesplay UK? If so, you might want to read this thread.

- René Wiersma
Hello, no Gamestalk my games Headwords and Cata-list

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Fri, 01/07/2005 - 13:55
#15
boardgamegeezer
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Re: Months

zaiga wrote:
boardgamegeezer wrote:
After submitting your game for appraisal you could wait months 7, 9, 10 months before they get back to you. Especially the big players.
Even then it can take one two years before they publish the game preparing etc.
This is from the moputh of my game development company in UK which are very well known with the board game and toy companies.
Aint fair is it?

By any chance, is your game development company Gamesplay UK? If so, you might want to read this thread.

- René Wiersma
Hello, no Gamestalk my games Headwords and Cata-list

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Fri, 01/07/2005 - 17:57
#16
Deviant
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Quote:
Heard back from Mayfair again. My game is still under consideration and will be undergoing more play testing.

Watch this space.

That's good news, but Mayfair is also holding a card game I designed and submitted all of one year ago. Their feedback has been slow in coming - partially because I, too, was afraid to prod them too hard. If I could do it again, I would have asked for a monthly status report from the very beginning.

I don't have much experience with the other publishers, but I suspect that Mayfair is just naturally a slow-moving business. I get the feeling that my game is at the end of a long list of hopefuls, and I wonder whether it is better to push forward and maybe get rejected or be polite and wait my turn.

The latest I've heard, my game was still undergoing playtesting and tweaking. That was three months ago. I think I'll send Mayfair another email...

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Mon, 08/08/2005 - 13:39
#17
simonh
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Mayfair politely declined...

I finally heard back from Mayfair: they respectfully declined my game design. They did provide some feedback from their play testers on some of the features that they felt my design was lacking. I didn't agree with most of their comments, but it did spur me on to re-write the rule booklet, condensing it down from a 16 page word doc to an 8-(half size)-page doc (25% of the original). Most of the savings were made by ripping out unnecessary images. The result is a much cleaner, crisper version.

For those who deal with Mayfair, be aware that they move slowly!

Well, no matter. On to the next publisher. Hoping to hear from them soon.

~S

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Mon, 08/08/2005 - 14:03
#18
HRPuffenstuf
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

If anything, consider that a positive that you were able to condense your rules down. I'll ride the fence here: On one hand, follow your gut. If they say phooey on some of your ideas, stay the course. On the other hand, if you can see their comments as valid (doesn't mean you have to like it), you might take their suggestions and see how you can merge your gut feelings with their suggestions.

Good Luck.

HR Puff

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Wed, 09/21/2005 - 14:22
#19
simonh
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Another Publisher
Some good news.. I have another publisher looking at the game. This time we established up front that:

+ they hope to provide me with a "Yay/Nay" by Thanksgiving
+ once-a-month "How's it going?" emails are acceptable

Blind Playtest
I recently had the opportunity to "blind playtest" the game with 3 members of a local game group. After dealing the cards and playing for about 5 minutes, they realised that they had missed an important rule, and decided to redeal the hand. After their initial false start, they were able to play the rest of the game just fine. There were a few questions that cropped up during gameplay, but these were each answered by referring to the rules. After finishing the game, there were a couple of comments and suggestions (duly noted), but generally the opinion was very positive about the game.

BGG.CON
I'm also planning on bringing the prototype with me to BGG.CON (BoardGameGeek's inaugural con) to generate some interest.

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Fri, 11/25/2005 - 21:56
#20
simonh
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

simonh wrote:
Another Publisher
Some good news.. I have another publisher looking at the game. This time we established up front that:

+ they hope to provide me with a "Yay/Nay" by Thanksgiving

It is with great pleasure that I can announce that Z-Man Games has agreed to publish my card game "Take Stock". Excellent news for Thanksgiving.

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Fri, 11/25/2005 - 23:18
#21
phpbbadmin
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

simonh wrote:
simonh wrote:
Another Publisher
Some good news.. I have another publisher looking at the game. This time we established up front that:

+ they hope to provide me with a "Yay/Nay" by Thanksgiving

It is with great pleasure that I can announce that Z-Man Games has agreed to publish my card game "Take Stock". Excellent news for Thanksgiving.

Holy Crap! Z-man comes through again! Our members and Z-man are really starting to form a great working relationship! Go Z-man! (and members). Now only if some of the other publishers would stand up and take notice. Congrats Simon!

-Darke

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Sat, 11/26/2005 - 05:53
#22
zaiga
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Congrats Simon! Maybe we should rename this site to Z-Man games designers forum? ;)

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Wed, 12/14/2005 - 16:53
#23
simonh
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Take Stock - Release: Spring 2006

Take Stock is scheduled for a Spring 2006 release.

http://www.boardgamenews.com/index.php/boardgamenews/comments/gone_cardb...

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Wed, 12/14/2005 - 17:26
#24
ensor
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

That's great news, Simon, congratulations! The protoype pictures up at BGG look very complete and descriptive; I should start annotating my digital pictures for my submissions, good idea. I'm waiting to hear back from Z-man myself, hopefully I'll have some news before Christmas.

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Fri, 06/09/2006 - 13:34
#25
simonh
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Re: Take Stock - Release: Spring 2006

simonh wrote:
Take Stock is scheduled for a Spring 2006 release.

I guess Spring 2006 was a little optimistic. Anyway, the artwork is approved and at the printers. They say the product will be ready to debut at GenCon Indy this year (August 10).

Oh, and Take Stock now has its own page on Zev's website.

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Fri, 06/09/2006 - 22:57
#26
Krakit
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Waiting for a Publisher to respond...

Z-man is also considering my game, Chase-Bots, for publication.

Through UPS tracking, I know that Zev recieved my prototype last Tuesday.

Carl

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