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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

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sfictre
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Joined: 12/31/1969

Ok guys,

why do we play games??
We does anybody play games?

For differant games and gamers there will be differant reasons, but there will most likely be simularities in the game types.

For example:
people might play risk for the strategy side of things.
poeple might play Dungen Crawlers or RPGs (like me) because I yearn for adventure and they give you that.
People might play 4 accross ect. for the social side.
People might play games like trouble, becuase they don't really feel like thinking and they like to have the chance in the game. It isn't competivite so people just play it for the fun of it.
I dunno.........

You see, if we can get a list.......even a basic list of game types; and the reasons why people play them. Then we will be able to make games that are more satisfying to the people that play the differant games.

I dunno if you guys can see where I'm going and I appologize for rambeling......lol. But it was I though I had, and it might just help us game designers to do a better job!

What do you guys think?

thanks guys
sfictre

sfictre
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Joined: 12/31/1969
Ok just to get you thinking.....

Just to help us think a bit,

What basic game types are there:

Strategy
Action
Adverture
Chance
RPG
Dungen Crawler
War
Card (magic, duel masters ect)

Help me add onto this list,
Then we will hopefully be able to begin defining why you play them and then hopefully find out why others play them.

~sfictre

Thought is the essence of games........

Zomulgustar
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Joined: 07/31/2008
A different perspective

I'm not sure how much help I can be to your project, since I'm not sure how one gets from being able to classify games to being able to create them. (Step 2: then a miracle occurs...). However, your thread did suggest an idea that I thought I'd share.

I propose that it might be more challenging and potentially productive to make a list of types of games that DON'T exist, and look into why not. For example, with all the cooperative games that have come out since Lord of the Rings, why has no-one made a two-player cooperative game? It seems like there would be a substantial market for such a game, so there must be complicating factors...

sfictre
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Joined: 12/31/1969
easy....

what i was meaning was that, after you classify the game types, and find out why people play them. Then you will be able to understand the market for the game type that you are trying to make. Therefore be more succesful.

And the only problem with identifying the game types that don't exist is just that. They don't exist. That dosn't mean that they can't be made. Mark my words......they will be made. But this isn't exactly something that we can just pull of the top of our heads. It will require alot of thought. But it is definatly a good idea.

......definatly a spanner in the works..........

I will come back later when my brain is working properly.

Thanks

~sfictre

larienna
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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

You cannot really classify games, neither can you do it for people, books or other variable stuff.

Look at board game seek, there is probably more than 100 game categories and there could be many ways to reorganise these game categories according to various taste.

For example, in a library, there is the dewey and the library of congress classification system. But I am sure that I can successfully find a book that does not fit in any of theses(ex: an RPG book).

If you want to know which kind of game people play to know which kind of game to make, I think that you should focus on game elements. Does the people play social games, abstract/themed games, complex/simple games, etc.

sfictre
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Joined: 12/31/1969
If we figure out why people play differant game types......

alass......it is not the game type that people play, that I seek. It is the reasons why people play the diff game types.

For eg.
People sometimes like a certain game type and not know exactly why they play it. (....ahhh, here we go......)
BUT, there almost always is a reason why. Like gamblers. The reason why people get hooked on gambleing is because the feeling they get when the numbers are spinning round, or just before the dice lands on it's number. They get this feeling of being special. This surge of excitment and the adrenilen rush.
Most don't know why they got hooked. They may think they could win the money......and most do think that. But in most cases they only gamble cuase of the feeling. As I said before, most don't even realise it.
Some do.

If you can find out why people play the game types, then you can make it more satisfying.
For example.
If they made a knew gambleing machine where it prolongs what numbers come. Or the actual out-come of the tumble is only deciced at the very end. Then more people would like that machiene better, though most wouldn't know why. (again like before)

So, even though BG RPG has nothing to do with gambleing, the principle still holds.
What I want to find out for know, is what the actual reason people play differant game types.
I think RPG and Dungen Crawler is becuase people want an adventure.
They take on the role of the person......while wishing they were there learning how to cast the powerful spells and finding echanted treasure.
They want to learn the things that they wish to learn. Some will wish to learn to be stalthy. and if the option is there.....they will make their char do the same..

Maybe now you can see where I'm going.

But for this to be succesful then we will need more peoples honest opinion.
Some people may not want to reveal why they like games.
For eg on this. They may consider themselves weak so they make their char tough and able-bodyed.
so on and so forth.

This could really help us game designers.
It will help me as much as it will help all of you.
No more. No less. What we do with the info after we have it..........
well......what do designers do???

thanks guys........thinks seriously......this info could make your career.
We need everybodys input for it to work

~sfictre

thought is the essence of games........

Rick-Holzgrafe
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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

sfictre wrote:
The reason why people get hooked on gambleing is because the feeling they get when the numbers are spinning round, or just before the dice lands on it's number.

Actually, there's a subtler reason based on "learned behaviors" and conditioned responses. It's easier to see in animals because we humans like to think we're rational, but it really does work with us too.

If you want an animal to learn to do a trick, you reward it whenever it does the trick successfully. If you reward the animal every time it does the trick, it will learn quickly... but if you then stop rewarding it, it will also forget quickly. But if you reward the animal only every few times, and somewhat at random, the animal will learn slowly and also forget slowly when you stop rewarding it.

So: design a game that rewards a player with something cool every couple of turns, especially if they can be other player's turns as well. The rewards should be frequent but somewhat unpredictable. If the game itself is fun, it will have the additional quality of being addictive -- or at least, habit-forming. People will continue to play because the frequent-but-ragged reward system conditions them to keep playing. This is one reason why so many video games are popular: every few seconds, you get a couple of points, or blow something up, or kill a monster, or achieve the next level.

I don't say that this is the only factor in making a popular game -- far from it! -- or that all popular games have this characteristic. But it's one that can help keep players coming back for more.

Stainer
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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

Larienna wrote:

For example, in a library, there is the dewey and the library of congress classification system. But I am sure that I can successfully find a book that does not fit in any of theses(ex: an RPG book).

Just to clarify for people - any book can be classified in both of these systems. These systems (Dewey and LC) are designed around the authors name, main subject, and a few other variables. So really, any book can be put into the LC or Dewey system.

Rob

Horoku
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Did we miss this?

Quote:
If you want to know which kind of game people play to know which kind of game to make, I think that you should focus on game elements. Does the people play social games, abstract/themed games, complex/simple games, etc.

I think that this comment may be more vital to explaining why we play games than we may think. Think about it. The REASON why we play games is simple, we like to have fun. Fun though, is probably one of the most subjective concepts on the face of the earth. So what we as designers try to do is find something that we find fun, and present it in a way that others will find it fun as well. But the problem in establishing codes of conduct or specific "why" reasons in gaming is that you could potentially have the most awesome concept in the universe, but if "player A" would rather play go fish, then to him/her, the concept is lost.

What Larienna touched on was the fact that when you think about the elements of the game, you get a glimpse into the personality of the person playing. For example, some people can't get enough of party games. Scatergories, Taboo, Pictionary to name a few. Look at what these games have in common. They don't require a ton of knowledge or experience. They usually spawn inside jokes. They are easy to learn and are good ice breakers. Now see if you can figure out a personality profile for the people who favor this type of game....

Dralius
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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

It sounds like you want to know the reasons people play games in general. Not so much a matter of why people play each type because within the types the rewards can be different. Every game has one or more rewards it offers to its players so the enjoyment is not so much the type of game but the combination of rewards, how they are delivered and in what quantity.

The common rearward elements are

Discovery – Actually learning the game and figuring out its system is compelling to many people especially children.

Winning – This is simple everyone like to win.

Thrill of the chase – Winning is fun but if its easy that reward loses its strength. The anticipation of winning and or possibly loosing generates its own thrill.

Socialization – This is what makes a party game a party game. The game forces people to discus and interact.

Escape – Strongly themed games especially those with roll playing elements allow people to get outside themselves and pretend to be someone else. (How many times have you played a pirate themed game and some said Aaarrrrggg?)

Humor – Some games get by mostly as a joke you can tell over and over. Often these games have a short shelf life and survive by putting of expansions (look new jokes).

Surprise/Chance – Gambling type games or those that are highly unpredictable offer this thrill of the unknown. I may win but who knows.

Performance – Players get to be the centers of attention as they perform in some way like singing, drawing, or act out a scene from a movie.

Showing off – Much like Performance but knowledge based, getting the answer right on a trivia question for example.

Many of these can be broken down into sub categories and I am sure I forgot one or two so feel free to add on.

You might think viewing game in this light would make me analytical about my designs but it does not. All the above rewards are emotional so I approach it based on how it makes people feel to play my games and how I can deliver a certain experience to them.

sfictre
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Joined: 12/31/1969
If we figure out why people play differant game types......

ah ha! Dralius finally got the right direction. Not meaning you didn't before, but not many before you did.

Yes these are some great examples.

So now, to narrow down a little bit. Why do people play RPG's and Dungen crawlers.
No, this isn't the whole reason I created this post.
But I am currently working on an RPG so I may as well find out what you guys think.

So far I have come up with:

People play it for the sense of adventuer that it gives you.

People play it because they wish they could be like the char that they have made. They wish they could be learning the powerful spells and strong moves; killing the orcs and undead that defile the earth......ect.

People play it becuase they want to know what happends and they got hooked. (if you have a good storyline)

People play it to defeat their friends. Or just play with or against your friends. (social)

People play it because you can make your char powerful, and they wish that they could be powerful.

People play it and make their char strong, becase they might get teased about being weak. This is a way to imagine yourself being strong.

And becuase it is an escape from life. It is an adventure and you can make yourself become part of another world.

Please feel free to add to the list that I have started.

thanks guys

~sfictre

thought is the essence of games........

w0rf
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Joined: 12/31/1969
If we figure out why people play differant game types......

I think boiled down to one of its simpler forms, it's about people developing a sense of accomplishment. Nearly all games have goals and means to achieve them. Arguably, the better games have multiple ways to achieve the same outcome (e.g. chess, Settlers, Grand Theft Auto). In each case, the enjoyment is heightened when the outcome is uncertain and the player has a genuine feeling that the choices he makes will directly affect the outcome. So I think that regardless of the game type, people like having a sense of significant involvement, which leads to a sense of immersion, and at the end, accomplishment.

Triktrak
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If we figure out why people play differant game types......

I look at games as a medium for human interaction. Being with and interacting with other people is fun, and we don’t always get to interact with people in the mundane world in the ways that games allow us to do. When was the last time you were at an auction, or bargained with someone for something, or decimated someone’s army with your superior strategy, or stole from them or bluffed someone, or competed with or really cooperated with someone for that matter. A lot of these activities seem to be built into our human nature and are pleasurable. Although they can’t be part of our lives all the time since we have our real-world roles to fill they can be part of our lives in game form. I know this doesn’t directly address your question, but it’s the way I look at it.

I think the only real accomplishment, I feel, is that I had some fun and maybe outsmarted someone else.

stumps
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Joined: 12/31/1969
If we figure out why people play differant game types......

The Following is just to help you along your way in gaining further understanding.
It is supplied as just a piec of information for you to add to whatever else you may find.

Here's a list that I've compiled mostly from an actual data survey that was done for certain forms of games. LINK TO ACTUAL SITE WITH SURVEY DATA
I modified a few areas to make more sense in a universal tone of gamming.
% is of 3199 surveyed game players.
(0.15% not shown due to rounding of %)

Achievement (all following make up 20.55%)

Advancement = 6.35%
Progress
Power
Accumulation
Status

Mechanics = 6.75%
Numbers
Optimization
Templating
Analysis

Competition = 7.45%
Challenging Others
Provocation
Domination

Social (all following make up 36.6%)

Socializing = 9.1%
Casual Chat
Helping Others
Making Friends

Relationship = 17.5%
Personal
Self-Disclosure
Find and Give Support

Teamwork = 10%
Collaboration
Groups
Group Achievements

Immersion (all following make up 42.7%)

Discovery = 10.3%
Exploration
Fictional Novelty
Surprises

Role-Playing (not meaning RPGing...meaning a ROLE) = 12.35%
Atmosphere Preference
Historical Inclination (fictional or real)
Role Taking
Fantasizing

Customization = 9.9%
Appearances
Accessories
Style
Color Schemes

Escapsim = 10.15%
Relaxation
Escape from Real Life
Neglect Stress related Responsibilities in Real Life

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