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Direct manufacturer quote from China

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 01:33
questccg
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Hello everyone,

Not too long ago I decided to contact Chinese manufacturers directly to see if I could get BETTER pricing than from a US supplier...

Obviously the US supplier would have the game made in China and take care of all the details including the shipping and delivery to my home.

What I fail to understand is why a direct quote from China costs MORE than dealing with the US?!?!

Firstly the Chinese manufacture quoted for 2,500 units, when I asked for quotes for both 500 and 1,000 units. So the total amount for 2,500 units (direct from China) was $23170.00 (or $9.27 per unit)!!! WOW... That's a lot of money!

The US manufacturer gave me quotes for 500, 1,000 and 2,000 units. So I don't have a shipping quote for 2,000 units, but let's just compare the unit price. 2,000 units from the US was $9,550 (or $4.78 per unit)! That's almost HALF the price!!!

So now my question to you is: can you imaging how CHEAP a Publisher can get the game made for? Less than $4.78!!! A typical first run will be around 2,000 units.

Obviously shipping is EXTRA - but still. I can't believe a Chinese manufacturer quoted me more than a US supplier! Go figure?!

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 18:14
#1
HPS74
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Joined: 01/06/2009
They may see you only as a

They may see you only as a one time project as opposed to continuous work.

Did you go back with a counter offer? Even advise them of the quote you were given by the US mob and see if they can match it....it's all back and forth.

There are plenty of options in China , so shop it around. You may have caught a new sales rep (the factory I use has regular turnover) and they might be trying to extract as much value from you as they can.

Every order I make, there's always something new. Cost of materials went up this month, worker wages have risen, shortage of a particular resin so a slight more expensive option is the only choice.....it's annoying, but sometimes you have to work with it.

And yes, manufacturers wouldn't be in the business unless they made some healthy profits!

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 19:29
#2
questccg
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I'm not sure about DIRECT.

See the thing that worries me is that the DIRECT Chinese manufacturer quoted me everything "piece meal". Each part of the game like decks, wooden cubes, dice, game mat, rulebook, box, tray, assembly... It was all separate. And most items had set-up charge (in addition to the price).

The US manufacturer kept things simple and based on my components, they quoted me a DIRECT price for 500, 1,000 and 2,000 units. It took a little while to get the shipping costs, but I did get them.

I'm also worried that if I tell the Chinese manufacturer that I want a better price, they may modify my request to use cheaper materials, worst paper and skimp on the overall quality of the game. With the US manufacturer, there is no worry about that. They state that they deliver a quality product at the best possible price point!

Since I am looking for a publisher, at least I am well informed about how much it's going to cost to make the game. I don't look like a noob if the publisher makes me a ridiculous offer...

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 20:12
#3
Some Random Dude
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Chinese Culture

Have you ever done business with a Chinese company before? Many other industrialized countries have standards, laws, and competition that advertises that makes businesses standardize their prices and make everything clear, but not China. Haggling is a part of their culture. It's really clear with street vendors and small shops, but I'd imagine it also happens with smaller niche companies. The first few times I tried buying something in China, when I turned them down after hearing the price they told me to come back and haggle. They don't change the quality, just want to see what they can get out of everyone.

I'm not saying this is definitely the case, as I've never done anything in this type of situation, but it's something you might think about.

EDIT: But, the fact that they would be sending everything piecemeal, and the US company would (I assume) package everything, makes it pretty clear to me who you should go with.

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 20:25
#4
questccg
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Difference in Quotes

Some Random Dude wrote:
But, the fact that they would be sending everything piecemeal, and the US company would (I assume) package everything, makes it pretty clear to me who you should go with.

Well see the *quote* is "piece-meal", they even have a charge for assembly. What I meant is that each aspect of the game had a price (and most of time an additional surcharge for set-up). Like $x.00 for 4 Decks with 15 cards, $x.00 for 1 Deck with 14 cards, $x.00 for tray, $x.00 for 30 page Rulebook, etc. I have to add that all up and then add the surcharges to the total to figure out the unit price point.

The US dealer made things simple: I got an e-mail with 3 lines ($x.00 for 500 units, $y.00 for 1000 units and $z.00 for 2000 units). They also included two surcharges: one for printer plates and one for the tray.

But there was no "Your 15 card decks will cost you $a.00." And "Your 30 page rulebook will cost you $b.00", etc.

The other thing I heard from reading some issues with US Publishers that use certain Chinese manufacturers is that EVEN Publishers have gotten bat batches of games (in terms of quality) from certain Chinese manufacturers. That's what worries me: if they can make subpar products for a Publisher, it could happen to me... What recourse do I have? Am I going to fly to China and visit the plant and complain to people who probably (most) don't speak any English??? You know what I mean?

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Sun, 02/23/2014 - 20:30
#5
Some Random Dude
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questccg wrote: What recourse

questccg wrote:
What recourse do I have? Am I going to fly to China and visit the plant and complain to people who probably (most) don't speak any English??? You know what I mean?

Well, I'm interested in getting a new job, and I need an excuse to brush up on my Chinese. :)

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Mon, 02/24/2014 - 07:42
#6
EdWedig
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Joined: 09/15/2009
If you are worried about the

If you are worried about the quality of the components from the Chinese manufacturer, make sure to request at "white box" sample. This will be a full game set of components (box, cards, rulebook, etc), without any printing. Then you can check the quality of the box construction, card thickness, etc.

(taken from James Mathes' excellent 10,000ft to Publishing:
http://jamesmathe.quora.com/10-000-Feet-to-Publishing-a-Board-Game)

-Ed

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Mon, 02/24/2014 - 09:53
#7
Dralius
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questccg wrote:See the thing

questccg wrote:
See the thing that worries me is that the DIRECT Chinese manufacturer quoted me everything "piece meal". Each part of the game like decks, wooden cubes, dice, game mat, rulebook, box, tray, assembly... It was all separate. And most items had set-up charge (in addition to the price)

Every quote I have seen lists the cost of each part of the game as a seperate item with the exception of setup cost wich are rolled into those items. That is where the difference come in in quantity, set up cost spead over 2000 units vs. 500.

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Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:27
#8
questccg
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Not in the US

Dralius wrote:
Every quote I have seen lists the cost of each part of the game as a seperate item with the exception of setup cost wich are rolled into those items. That is where the difference come in in quantity, set up cost spead over 2000 units vs. 500.

Not the ones I have received from Ad Magic and QPC. Both those US manufacturers just quote the price for 500, 1000 and 2000 units. They also mention one time set-up fees (such as plates and tray). But there is no breakdown for the cost of dice, the price for a booklet, etc. There are 3 prices based on quantity. That's it.

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Tue, 02/25/2014 - 20:33
#9
Aerjen
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Joined: 08/28/2008
US or China, doesn't matter. Specs do.

In getting quotes for a couple of games sometimes US manufacturers are cheaper and sometimes the Chinese manufacturers are more affordable. Oh and sometimes the US manufacturer gets your stuff printed in China anyway :D

I would be concerned with not getting specifications for all the components. In getting quotes from manufacturers in China and in the US I sometimes received quotes with costs specified per item and sometimes only the overall cost. Personally I prefer seeing a breakdown of costs and component specifications.

Here's an example of the specs on the cards that I got from a US manufacturer for one of my games.

Cards: 2.75” x 4.75”, 310 gsm C2S gray core, 4/4 print with aqueous varnish, diecut for rounded corners & shrink wrapped as one deck

This manufacturer both gave me an overall cost (per 500, 1000 and 2000 units) and a cost breakdown per item. Facts and specs are the things that make me trust a company.

If you're interested in learning more about the differences in materials then you can find a good starter guide here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/789423/game-design-and-self-publishing-a...

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