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[GDS] FEBRUARY 2014 "From Nothing, Something" - Critiques

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davidwpa
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Feedback

Hi everyone,

I appreciate the feedback so far. I do agree having thought about this for the last week or two that including zero as an option makes no sense. Initially in my mind it provided a balance, but I quickly realized that it throws the game off.

I'm not sure about the 40% statistic Mr. S stated as far as winning, but I do think one way to eliminate it is to make the option 1-4 stones which also balances the combinations of evens and odds. The other rule I thought about adding after contemplation some more while waiting to get your critiques is I would probably test adding a rule that you are not allowed to bid the same number of stones twice in a row but I would have to see if that is a benefit or not.

I look forward to reading more of your feedback. I have not been doing this long and every critique is helpful toward moving from theoretical design to practical solutions and I thank all of you for helping me to view designs from a different point of view.

Peace,

David

regzr
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rocks in the pot

Rocks in the Pot got my silver. The game lives well in the spirit of GDS February. Shamelessly stretches the rule of one component. I didn't notice that pockets equal bags.

It's likely that the scoring system could be modified to satisfy tactical players.

(If some day there will be three big stones among those twelve and a big one wins three small ones.)

regzr
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who? where?

If I understood, the "who" can be goldfish and the "where" can be... opera. The storyteller may get confused how to make sense those two appearing in a same narrative. Can be fun. Almost certainly is fun.

I worried a little bit that Who? Where? will be doomed as "no board game" by folks, so I left it out of my medalist list. The scoring looks good enough, that the activity can be defined as a game.

regzr
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thank you for the feedback

Quote:
My first impression of this game was that the only bit of agency was trying to detect whether or not someone was lying from their voice.

I've been reading all feedback about Keep Your Voice Calm. MaxGamesSeidman, you're right. The game is there: to detect from their voice whether or not someone was lying. If it is somewhere. That is why, because my design process was inspired by the game Close to the Border (Hart an der Grenze), where each player declares what he is carrying and a sheriff picks someone to a spot check.

davidwpa, thanks for the medal and for serious and rightful doubts!

Mr.S: "If I may speak for the designer, I believe that 11 was the correct total number to use." Yes, you may, especially when you explain the total 11 better than I ever could. Thanks! And I was glad to read your long feedback. And if you wondered what I intended to do with the 10 row, I can now reveal that when speaking of "the tableau" (= ten row), the 500 word limit came close and I gave up. The tableau should have had many more rules, but because unfinished, I left them out.

danieledeming
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Who, Where? Critique

I liked the simplicity of this game and the voting style scoring similar to Apples to Apples (and Balderdash, and Rules Against Humanity, and Wise and Otherwise...etc.) It's effective and gives players an incentive to serve their own interests as well as make the game more interesting.

This didn't make the medals for me, but not by design, I just am simply not the right audience for story-telling games...that's what makes the game world so dynamic!

anonymousmagic
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"Rocks in the Pot" and "Who? Where?" -- Feedback

Although Rocks in the Pot technically fit the challenge criteria, it lost out on a medal, because stones tend to be a common type of component. I judged this one mainly on creativity and originality. Together with the fact that scoring could be improved upon and the feeling that -- for me -- there weren't enough interesting gameplay decisions. With a little bit more tweaking, it will probably make a good game regardless of my opinion, though.

Who? Where? didn't make the medal podium because it clearly violated the challenge rules. A pen and a piece of paper are both components and that is without the timekeeping device. The number of players made it a hard sell for me personally and since I was judging mainly on originality and creativity, it lost there, because I've known a very similar game for at least 10 years.

danieledeming
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Rocks in the Pot Critique

Mathematically, with the 0 in play, this game didn't make sense to me, it was definitely skewed. However, that said, even with even math, it's more a time-waster than an actual strategic game. Like war, or RPS. I didn't see a lot of player interaction or decision making that would keep it interesting for me.

Mr.S
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60 tiles

I just wanted to jump ahead of people on this:
After the submission deadline, I realized a big flaw in the game design. If a player decides to connect into another player's line, they will be connecting two different colors. Obviously that cant actually work.
I have no plans on developing this game, but if I did, I would make the game all one color and the starting tile tri-directional.

Mr.S
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Dicey Moves

Good game. Looks like a fun little game. I can’t see anything in the description that would suggest this game wouldn’t work. It needs play testing and possibly some math to figure out how to making scoring work best. Other than that, I am just not that attracted to it. Maybe it’s because dice have been around for so long, or that set collection has been overdone (I’m guilty of using it too). I don’t know. I wouldn’t say, “no” to playing this game…
I’m not sure you used pips correctly… Admittedly, I had to look up the meaning, so maybe someone can correct me. A pip is any of the dots on the dice. So, three consecutive pips (dots) doesn’t mean anything. I think you meant three consecutive dice with equal values showing. A dice showing 'three' would have three consecutive pips. Anyways, this really doesn’t have anything to do with my evaluation it’s just for clarification, and hopefully someone smarter than me can correct me here.
Why are there different colors? Is this so one player can mess up the plans of another player by taking a color they need? I think you may be able to make this game with less dice by eliminating the colors and just have players collecting runs and sets based on normal dice. Alternatively, you could use D9s with values 1-3 and three colors.

bike
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Rocks in the pot - critique

Two things to add I have not read in the other comments: When equal numbers mean stones go in the pot, that is unfair for the even player.
Good idea to have players not select the same number of stones twice. Give the game a bit more play/options.

bike
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Who? Where? - critique

My bronze medal. Not really zero components, but all components are not hard to find in your house. Since it performed well in player interaction, and I would like to play this (I love making up weird stories) it ended up being my bronze.

bike
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60 Tiles - critique

Tiles are too similar to cards, which were forbidden. I rejected this entry just because of that.
Having the option to either enlarge your own path, or to remove a part from the path of another player... that means that the player ahead will never win.
I understand you do not continue with this game. I suggest looking at http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1038/tantrix, it resembles 60 tiles.

bike
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Dicey moves - critique

It was me who asked if a dice was a valid component. The one bit information for me would be the orientation of the cube. Having colored dice means two bits of information. Outside of the GDS limits.
The game can be fun. There are a few things I do not understand. Why is a player allowed to rethrow the active dice? This is a free chance for every player to see if anything goods comes up. And if not, the dice passes back to the active player, and that player must at least discard one dice.

Mr.S
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bike wrote: I understand you

bike wrote:

I understand you do not continue with this game. I suggest looking at http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/1038/tantrix, it resembles 60 tiles.

wow, that's almost exactly the picture i had in my head... spooky.

Ya, I was still quite ill during the submission week and wasn't going to make a submission, but then remembered this idea I had a few months ago. It just never interested me to actually make this game... submitted just for the hell of it.

regzr
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dicey moves

I had a unhappy voting, because I had just bought Las Vegas and I was anxious to see "what happens when money is removed from the equation". It was unfair to expect Dicey Moves to be a sharpened version of Las Vegas.

Passing the active die emerges many options. But it makes rulebook thicken. I can't remember all those options. I expected too much; one or two clear principles to run the game.

regzr
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60 tiles

Now, after I saw the Tantrix images, I realize what "body" means. Unless you didn't mean ended loops, instead the middle fragments of a line.

"NOTE: If a player can connect into another player’s line, the tail of that player becomes the head of the connecting player’s line. The line that was broken is now part of the connecting player’s line."
This sentence does not satisfy common sense. 60Tiles is not Tantrix, but in the beginning all players choose one color each. They try to extend their line, so their color line? It is visually ugly to allow a line, which starts as red and suddenly continues as blue line.

Nice try to make some new action to tile-laying with destroy action. I like tiles and puzzles, but didn't warm up this time.

Just for sport, check this out:
http://www.bgdf.com/image/transparent-tiles-two-layers

Corsaire
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Dicey moves & 60 tiles

Had component issues with both of these.

Dicey moves with colors and pips was well out of my criteria for the challenege and didn't look much further than that. In reread, I had sme trouble seeing the enjoyment with the passing the dice and rerolling and such. Watched the Las Vegas Tabletop last night and was also confusd with the rolling and Boss designation in that game.

60 tiles, felt like cards, had colors and multiple meaning lines also not a fit for the challenege. I didn't push too far as it felt like other abstracts and some lightly themed dragon growing games I've seen and also a bit like Tsuoro (sp?)

Mr.S
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sell me this pen

I see someone has recently watched, “The Wolf of Wall Street”, lol. It appears that a few people have decided to go the party game route in this challenge. I kind of wish I thought of that, as most party games require very little in terms of components. Who is the winner in this game, when is the ‘selling’ component of the game satisfied? Maybe each player can have a certain amount of currency to spend and the player who ends up with the most, wins.
I think this game might be more fun if, on each round, a new item is selected from in the room to be sold. Instead of adjectives, you could have different customers to sell to as well.
Personally, I don’t really enjoy these role-playing games. I can’t remember what game it was, but I had to sell a pencil to a houseplant once… On the upside, I had to spank a girl in that game too. I think it depends on the group of people that you have.
Here is an idea for a role playing game: It’s a complimentary game that can be played the entire game night in addition to other games. Each player has a specific task (touch as many knees as possible, mention Japan as many times as possible, etc.) Each person keeps track of how many times they can get away with the action until someone guesses their action. After being outed, the players will write their final score on a board until the last person is outed or the end of the night comes. The caveat here is that the game needs to be purchased and no one can see the cards beforehand.

Mr.S
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Pop Star Drag Racing

Well, this game can work when you have not much time or resources at your disposal (for example, during break time or waiting for a train).
I’m not sure what this game has to do with pop stars OR drag racing. Racing yes, drag racing… no. This game is essentially a roll and move game but with a coin, which means even less possibilities. Also, for a simple game like this one, there is far too much math and technically 3 components, but let’s say it is just a coin. Game can be played anywhere but is abstract in that you have to imagine the cars moving. This came really could benefit from a visual. Of course that would break the limits of this showdown… but you could just flip a coin ten times each and see who has the most heads. After all that is the game you pitched.

Here is an idea for a one component pop star drag racing game. All that is required is a newspaper. Everyone chooses a famous celebrity (preferably with a common name). Every time their first name appears in the newspaper, they get gas. However, they can only use this gas if they find the last name (acceleration). When the first name is mentioned, you rip a small piece of paper from the corner of the newspaper and keep it in your hand. When you find acceleration, you place it on the table to keep track of how fast you are going. If you find the celebrity’s name (first and last together) you get a NOS boost and can immediately place three pieces of paper on your speedometer. The paper must be done one page (in order). Play finishes at the end of a newspaper section or until a certain speed is reached.

bike
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Sell me this pen - critique

I got the fun part, I did not get the game part. What if noone buys your pen? How keep the score? Not that it is really needed for a fun game like this, but it witheld me from voting for it.

bike
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Pop star drag racing - critique

Aah, a notepad... not really one item. The game itself feels complex for the actual gameplay. When the idea is to play it everywhere, there is a lot to remember.
Taking the heart of the game, flipping coins, winning a track, or not, that could be a perfect waiting game f.i. for public transport.

Corsaire
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Sell me this pen

I'm not seeing the gamification of this much beyond the sort of exercise already used at a sales conference or such. It's fun that it is literally a single component, and the flavor advice is interesting.

Some sort of crowd scoring or voting would take this from exercise to closer to a game.

regzr
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sell me this pen

You described so wonderfully tastefully the idea of the game. Tips on not being a blockhead - those came in need to me. Sorry that people lack imagination and party games dry out after a few rounds. It was a bold move to expose a this type of game to criticism. Carry on, please.

regzr
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pop star drag racing

I did not fancy the theme, but I liked the fifty dollars and coin flip. Challenge urged to create something from almost nothing and this is it. Coin flip may be the simpliest random element and connected with money we have a very basic gambling.

Why do people gamble? Freud explained why there is humour, but even he couldn't analyze thoroughly phenomena gambling. Never mind, your game extracts the very essence of coin flip.

anonymousmagic
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Pop Star Drag Racing

(I lost my review because I actually closed my browser when I had nearly finished my post. Please forgive me for making this one a little shorter.)

Although I liked the idea of racing with a coin toss, I was not very impressed with the $50 cash per player. It was clear you'd lose money for 4 tails in a row, but the rules did not explain when you would win money and how much. I know you're on a word limit, but for me such a crucial detail needs to be in there.

In the end I did not award this game a medal for the same reason I didn't give one to "Who, Where?". To keep scores on paper means you have both paper and coins as components, even if you use your teeth to rip the paper to keep score. Also, while the mechanic is refreshing, it doesn't offer much interesting gameplay decisions to the player.

anonymousmagic
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Sell Me This Pen -- Feedback

My first instinct was: how can you turn a job interview question into a game? But the general idea grew on me.

I'm a stickler for rules, though, and although I like party games, this one was short on too many crucial rules for me to award a medal. How do you decide who wins? What if no one buys the pen? How do you decides who gets the pen if multiple people want to buy? How to avoid scammy backhand deals between friends and points awarded on politics instead of good play?

Simply too many open ends for me.

richdurham
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Great month

Do you guys see that comment counter? Over 100 critiques and designer responses for the February GDS. Amazing effort by all the designers to meet some very tough critics. So big congratulations go to our top three winners - Bike (Angry Stickmen), Sonofman (Sow that all may eat), MaxGamesSiedman (Ivory tower) and Wehrner (Starfield).

Since this month was doubled up we have a bit of a break before the March GDS.

Next month will introduce some more changes to the GDS system to address the growing participation. That's thanks to all of you designers that have been participating, particularly you designers that have been submitting entries every month. This is a good problem to have.

donut2099
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Sorry for missing out on the

Sorry for missing out on the last few critiques , life just caught up to me. good job everybody :)

Corsaire
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These have been very fun and

These have been very fun and certainly refines the critical eye. Downside, I now have three more games I'm pretty psyched about finishing competing for my attention. This month's challenge has really emphasized editing and component cost management for me.

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