Skip to Content

Nightlancer Kickstarter page preview, looking for feedback (updated)

Ok I've been working on the details for this for a while. It's time to put it out there so you can all tear it apart ;)

Currently I am focused on the *content*. So pledge levels, description, reach goals, the competition, schedule, etc.

The graphics are all temporary and will get redone. I'd still welcome good ideas for things I could do with the graphics, but I know the *quality* of the graphics at the moment is mediocre.

The playthrough video and intro video are currently in development. I'll update when those are included.

I'm still getting information about translation, competition prizes, etc so likewise will post an update when they're finalised.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/619659500/858928298?token=472ec97f

Comments

Is it a good idea to mention

Is it a good idea to mention which printer/fulfilment/etc I'm going to use in the KS page?

(I can't think of anything wrong with it, seems like it would be encouraging for backers - tell them I've worked out all these details)

I've updated the contents and

I've updated the contents and reach goal entries now too.

I've done a lot of updates on

I've done a lot of updates on it now, would welcome a fresh look.

(and I got all personal and stuff *shudders* I don't normally do that)

I'm currently talking to my

I'm currently talking to my artists about getting some better graphics done for the section headings, reach goals, etc.

I'm also going to get a couple of example card designs done, with full illustration and graphics, so potential backers can see what the different in quality between the prototype and the final version is.

(also: these journal page style comments are a bit confusing, it's hard to find *where* the new comment is)

Feedback

There's one obvious typo as "necesarry" should be "necessary".

I agree that the rulebook should be available to anyone, I shouldn't have to pay anything, even £1 to get a look at that. I always feel campaigns that hide their rulebook behind a paywall are preventing me from getting an honest look at their standard of visual design, layout and writing. If the rules are good, they will attract backers; if they're bad then making me pay for them won't help.

Also, just out of interest, why have you chosen Birmingham as a setting? It's not somewhere that resonates with high-tech, dystopian, exciting or any other words one might associate with cyberpunk. I know London would be cliché but Birmingham? Seems a very odd choice to me.

The prototype rulebook is

The prototype rulebook is available to get (though the link not currently in there, but it will be before I launch).

The paywall for getting the PDF is for getting the *finished* rulebook, which I will only have once I have the funding to get the graphics done, so I can hardly offer the rules PDF to incentivise backers.

But I *could* just make the final rules PDF available to everyone when it's at a finished level, rather than adding the paywall to it, and I don't really have a good reason not to (it's not a game you could rip off just by having the rulebook, and I've already got the prototype PDF out there anyway).

How about I rephrase it:

Quote:
Early access rulebook PDF. You'll receive a copy of the rulebook PDF as soon as it is finished.

I guess I could add in a thanks to it (not in the rulebook, that would take too much space, but I could add a "thank you" page listing all backers on the website).

Why Birmingham: As you say, London would be cliche (and I have other plans for London). Birmingham is a major city, enough for people to easily fall through the cracks.
It does kinda resonate as dystopian (I keep an eye on the Birmingham news), though I accept this may not be a well-known perception.
Do you have a better alternative in England?

Just let people read it!

iamseph wrote:
But I *could* just make the final rules PDF available to everyone when it's at a finished level, rather than adding the paywall to it, and I don't really have a good reason not to (it's not a game you could rip off just by having the rulebook, and I've already got the prototype PDF out there anyway).

...And also, if you put your rulebook in front of as many eyes as possible, you may get a bit extra proofreading done before you send it to print.

The £1 pledge level should probably just be, "Thanks, you're awesome, and you'll be able to read the backer-only updates."

polyobsessive wrote:iamseph

polyobsessive wrote:
iamseph wrote:
But I *could* just make the final rules PDF available to everyone when it's at a finished level, rather than adding the paywall to it, and I don't really have a good reason not to (it's not a game you could rip off just by having the rulebook, and I've already got the prototype PDF out there anyway).

...And also, if you put your rulebook in front of as many eyes as possible, you may get a bit extra proofreading done before you send it to print.

That's a good point.

polyobsessive wrote:
The £1 pledge level should probably just be, "Thanks, you're awesome, and you'll be able to read the backer-only updates."

Hmm, I suppose the important question is: what am I trying to achieve by *not* giving access to everyone.

I guess I was thinking of exclusivity. But that's hardly selling it.

So yeah I'll get rid of the early pdf access.

Thanks for poking me, I don't think I'd properly thought through what I was trying to achieve. Now I have, it's dumb.

If I had to pick somewhere

If I had to pick somewhere I'd probably pick Manchester, although my inclination would actually be to make a fictional city either from scratch or by combining two relatively close cities (Manchester and Liverpool, for example) into one massive sprawl. But it's up to you, of course, and it sounds like you already have plans.

Early access still sounds like you're holding off the rulebook unless you can get people's money first. If you must have a £1 level I'd lean more toward the "thank you" thing.

Manchester is less polluted

Manchester is less polluted and more spread out than Birmingham though. I recall Birmingham as being the crappiest place I spent a night in England.

I agree about the £1 thank you.

Good Start

I think it's a good start, but here are my initial thoughts.

Pledge Levels: at the first level, maybe it should just be the standard thank you? I know most people don't do the $1 backing if they are interested in the project anyway -- they'll do the level that gets them the game. I also just think that the rule book should be available to anyone to generate interest in the game, that's just me though. I know there have been a few projects that looked interesting and I didn't back until I got a look at the rule book. Also the "As Wannabe" and the other "As ____" confuse me a little bit with the wording. I also think the face pledge levels need to be more expensive. I don't know if you are converting people's faces into images for the game, but that seems like a low bar for something that is typically reserved for the $500-$1,000 benchmark for other games I have seen.

Description: I think the description of everything is fine. My only concern is there seems to be a lot of stipulation as to why the art isn't where it needs to be or the components aren't where they need to be. I would just say it's a prototype and move on, almost seems like there is too much acknowledgement as to how the game isn't where it needs to be.

Reach Goals: The localization seems like a bust as a reward, and the prints seem nice, but I almost feel like there should be more emphasis on what unlocks with the current game like characters or mechanics. Expansions are nice, but there should be some stretch goals that add goodies to the current game, just a thought.

Competition: I think the prizes are fine, but they aren't driving me to purchase or support the game, I think everything else that leads up to the competition is more important in your Kickstarter.

I think the graphics need the most updating to drum up that excitement. I don't think they are mediocre at all, I just think there needs to be more art in general. I'm just not getting as much cyber punk as I want I guess. The logo might need some neon or flair outside of the steel texture to make it feel more connected to the art that you already have completed? Also some closeups on the cards etc. might help. I get a little nervous when I see a game on Kickstarter that is obviously still in development and needs to get a good chunk of the art done. It makes it hard to picture the world and it makes it a gamble as to what the final product will look like, this all plays into consumer psychology though. Then again, I have seen really incomplete games do very well. For me personally, I would make the product look as finished as possible before finalizing the Kickstarter. What you have here is great, I just want to see more of it :) I hope some of this rambling helps.

jonathanflike wrote:Pledge

jonathanflike wrote:
Pledge Levels: at the first level, maybe it should just be the standard thank you? I know most people don't do the $1 backing if they are interested in the project anyway -- they'll do the level that gets them the game. I also just think that the rule book should be available to anyone to generate interest in the game, that's just me though.

I answered this part to stevebarkeruk above, made some suggestions about other ways to do it.

jonathanflike wrote:
I know there have been a few projects that looked interesting and I didn't back until I got a look at the rule book. Also the "As Wannabe" and the other "As ____" confuse me a little bit with the wording.

How about "As Wannabe pledge level"?
or "In addition to Wannabe"?

jonathanflike wrote:
I also think the face pledge levels need to be more expensive. I don't know if you are converting people's faces into images for the game, but that seems like a low bar for something that is typically reserved for the $500-$1,000 benchmark for other games I have seen.

I've seen games offering that at a range of prices. My sense of it is that the really high-priced ones don't actually get backed much? (i can't cite sources on that, tho, maybe my impression of this is off)
So sure I could charge £500 for Protagonist, but would anyone pay for that? (especially given that it wont be included in the game - just in a future project)

jonathanflike wrote:
Description: I think the description of everything is fine. My only concern is there seems to be a lot of stipulation as to why the art isn't where it needs to be or the components aren't where they need to be. I would just say it's a prototype and move on, almost seems like there is too much acknowledgement as to how the game isn't where it needs to be.

Year, fair point, I'll cut it back a bit. I think I keep mentioning it because I'm self-conscious about it.

jonathanflike wrote:
Competition: I think the prizes are fine, but they aren't driving me to purchase or support the game, I think everything else that leads up to the competition is more important in your Kickstarter.

Yeah I don't expect them to - after all, you don't even need to be a backer to enter the competition.

What I'm aiming for there is *visibility*, people who enter it do so with a tweet. So it ups the number of people talking about the game on social media.

jonathanflike wrote:
I think the graphics need the most updating to drum up that excitement. I don't think they are mediocre at all, I just think there needs to be more art in general.

Yeah at the moment, I've already got all of the finished art that exists on show there (which is: Nightlancer illustrations, cover illustrations and Nightlancer title)

I could commission some graphic design though, to make the section titles look more professional and gives a better sense of the final graphic design. I know it would all be more appealing if I had all the finished artwork on show, but that's going to cost a lot :/

I could get some concept sketches from my illustrator. They wouldn't look finished either of course, but do you think that would help give people a clearer picture that of the high-quality artwork that will be in the final product?

How about "As Wannabe pledge

How about "As Wannabe pledge level"? or "In addition to Wannabe"?

"In addition to Wannabe" makes the most sense, like I knew what you were talking about, but it just sounded odd.

I've seen games offering that at a range of prices. My sense of it is that the really high-priced ones don't actually get backed much? (i can't cite sources on that, tho, maybe my impression of this is off) So sure I could charge £500 for Protagonist, but would anyone pay for that? (especially given that it wont be included in the game - just in a future project)

You're right, I have seen similar offers at all price ranges, but the majority of what I see is name a component or card etc. This is more of a response as to how much time vs. money you think it's worth to do this additional labor. Here is a link to Epic's offerings. I know there are more, but this one came to mind immediately because of the high price tag.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1172937197/epic-card-game/description

Yeah at the moment, I've already got all of the finished art that exists on show there (which is: Nightlancer illustrations, cover illustrations and Nightlancer title) I could commission some graphic design though, to make the section titles look more professional and gives a better sense of the final graphic design. I know it would all be more appealing if I had all the finished artwork on show, but that's going to cost a lot :/ I could get some concept sketches from my illustrator. They wouldn't look finished either of course, but do you think that would help give people a clearer picture that of the high-quality artwork that will be in the final product?

You don't have to have every piece of art finished, you just need a little bit more I feel. I think this game currently on Kickstarter does a great job of pretending it has more art done than it does.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/gamesknight/haven-titan-command

It just looks polished and, you kinda forget the fact scrolling through it that you've seen the same piece of art repeat at least four times. It's because every jpeg they slap on their Kickstarter is a little piece of graphic art in and of itself. It hits a visual reset button so to speak. Now even they stipulate in the Kickstarter that the game isn't done and they have to actually commission the +100 cards they are promising in the final version, but for all intents and purposes it looks pretty well done with what they have, and they use the different pictures to build upon the world they are creating. It's not so much about dropping a ton of money on more art, just using what you do have the most effectively. If you download their rule book and print and play, you'll realize how little there actually is, but could have fooled most people from the presentation of it all. I mean if you check out their Facebook etc. you'll find this same art has been lingering for over two years now. I'm not saying this Kickstarter will be successful or is the end all of Kickstarter presentation, but it did catch my eye and made me sit with it and look at everything they put together. I would not recommend putting unfinished art in the Kickstarter though. It's a personal big turn off, because this is your pitch and you want to put your best foot forward. Just my thoughts on it, hope some of this helps. I just want you to have a super successful campaign! :)

jonathanflike wrote:You're

jonathanflike wrote:
You're right, I have seen similar offers at all price ranges, but the majority of what I see is name a component or card etc. This is more of a response as to how much time vs. money you think it's worth to do this additional labor. Here is a link to Epic's offerings. I know there are more, but this one came to mind immediately because of the high price tag.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1172937197/epic-card-game/description

Well, there are a few issues there.

They only got 4 backers *even though* the campaign was a massive, explosive success. (not that I'd turn down $4000 extra funding, but my point is I think they only got that many big spender backers *because* they were such a success)

They're also offering to actually *make* the character and include it in the game right off - I'm only offering someone the character design, not inclusion in the game.

They're also offering to let the backer in on the whole development process - that in itself will be a lot of work for them. I've specifically limited Protagonist backers to a tweet-length (ie 140 characters) concept - that gives me a lot more room to manoeuvre and more control to help ensure game balance.

I do kind of want to include super-pledge levels tho, I started a thread on this since it heads into discussion of general KS theory:
http://www.bgdf.com/forum/game-creation/publication/kickstarter-super-pl...

jonathanflike wrote:
You don't have to have every piece of art finished, you just need a little bit more I feel. I think this game currently on Kickstarter does a great job of pretending it has more art done than it does.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/gamesknight/haven-titan-command

It just looks polished and, you kinda forget the fact scrolling through it that you've seen the same piece of art repeat at least four times. It's because every jpeg they slap on their Kickstarter is a little piece of graphic art in and of itself. It hits a visual reset button so to speak. Now even they stipulate in the Kickstarter that the game isn't done and they have to actually commission the +100 cards they are promising in the final version, but for all intents and purposes it looks pretty well done with what they have, and they use the different pictures to build upon the world they are creating. It's not so much about dropping a ton of money on more art, just using what you do have the most effectively. If you download their rule book and print and play, you'll realize how little there actually is, but could have fooled most people from the presentation of it all. I mean if you check out their Facebook etc. you'll find this same art has been lingering for over two years now. I'm not saying this Kickstarter will be successful or is the end all of Kickstarter presentation, but it did catch my eye and made me sit with it and look at everything they put together. I would not recommend putting unfinished art in the Kickstarter though. It's a personal big turn off, because this is your pitch and you want to put your best foot forward. Just my thoughts on it, hope some of this helps. I just want you to have a super successful campaign! :)

Yeah I see what you mean. I should be able to get something more like that as I talk with my artists.

Appreciated, and me too :)

Link has been fixed.

Link has been fixed.

This game should have had me at "Hello."

Your headline conveys the theme but feels disjointed. I'd do something more like:

"Sell out to get ahead as an underworld mercenary in this competitive cyberpunk game."

I get that terse. short. sentences. are a narrative style, but clarity and concision in sales copy works a little differently.

The setting feels like a rehash of Pondsmith's Cyberpunk 2020. I feel like your pitch focuses on many elements of the setting that are least applicable to the game experience, or rather, you don't define the connection. Do nuclear weapons and bio-terrorism come into play?

This is about edgerunning -- no, shadowrunning -- errr, nightlancing, right? So how about something more visceral and immediate to the characters' experience? Their experience is going to be far more compelling than the mirrorshade history lesson we've all heard countless times before. What sets this apart from Fantasy Flight's Android franchise and Netrunner license?

It is not very wise to charge an extra £100 to have something included in a future supplement. You are creating a contract with your backers guaranteeing that you will generate this content within a reasonable time frame even if you go bankrupt, get cancer, have triplets, and join a doomsday cult in Glasgow.

I find the fancy font in the contents section too hard to read.

Drop lines like "I like this excerpt particularly since it really hits the mark:" from your review section. Obviously, you feel that way or you wouldn't include it. That's the point of an excerpt.

This is a remarkably expensive game. You have the high funding goals of a KS that will fail the first time around and then do better the second time when production costs get reined in. For starters, you really don't need custom dice. We all want our ideas to be the prettiest girl at the prom, but the fact is that you are also hustling them on the street corner. You compromise your artistic integrity to demonstrate that you have the business sense to deliver a final product in a timely fashion at an affordable price. Why pay you all of this money when Netrunner is $30 at my local game store?

You are overextending yourself by running a competition. Were I backing your project, I'd feel like my money is being spent to cover the costs of dorks duct taping circuit boards to their elbows. There is no need to have a concept album. Likewise, though your "What's Next" section lays out an ambitious plan for future releases, the pie chart for your budget doesn't reflect a strategy for growth. There is a point where listing off projects sounds less like future planning and veers into the realm of lack of focus on the task at hand. Keep it short.

Lastly, there is a lot about what you want to do and nothing about who you are. Backers need to know something about you and have a strong sense of your accountability and ownership of the project.

Soulfinger wrote:Your

Soulfinger wrote:
Your headline conveys the theme but feels disjointed. I'd do something more like:

"Sell out to get ahead as an underworld mercenary in this competitive cyberpunk game."

I get that terse. short. sentences. are a narrative style, but clarity and concision in sales copy works a little differently.

That would be misleading - selling out is a choice, not a necessity. I thought it was good to include emphasis on that in the headline, I think it's one of the more evocative parts.

But I do see what you mean about it being disjointed. The sentences don't quite fit together. I'm trying to put dense information in there but it's a bit forced at the moment.

Here's a rewrite:
"A competitive cyberpunk game. Take underworld contracts to survive dystopian 2099. Do you sell out your values to get ahead?"
Less fragmented?

Soulfinger wrote:
The setting feels like a rehash of Pondsmith's Cyberpunk 2020. I feel like your pitch focuses on many elements of the setting that are least applicable to the game experience, or rather, you don't define the connection. Do nuclear weapons and bio-terrorism come into play? This is about edgerunning -- no, shadowrunning -- errr, nightlancing, right? So how about something more visceral and immediate to the characters' experience? Their experience is going to be far more compelling than the mirrorshade history lesson we've all heard countless times before. What sets this apart from Fantasy Flight's Android franchise and Netrunner license?

Yeah ok. I'll move the backstory to my collection of bits to include in backer updates. I'll work on something more in line with the actual game experience for the intro story.

I consider Android a sci-fi setting, not a particularly cyberpunk one. It's more high tech without the low life. More glitz and corporate, less dirty bloodstained streets. More teen angst, less rebel punk.
(that's having played Android, Infiltration, and the original Netrunner, I've not actually looked at the Android world book so mb I'm off on that)

There is more similarity between Nightlancer and CP2020 in feel. But CP2020 has no board game, so it's not like there's some another game I'm competing with in that comparison.

It's true that people might see it as *just* a rehash, which is offputting. There are some fundamental differences in philosophy between NL and CP2020, but focusing on that isn't going to sell people on the game. I don't have a good answer here right now. I'll mull it over and get back to it later in the week.

Soulfinger wrote:
It is not very wise to charge an extra £100 to have something included in a future supplement. You are creating a contract with your backers guaranteeing that you will generate this content within a reasonable time frame even if you go bankrupt, get cancer, have triplets, and join a doomsday cult in Glasgow.

The exact thing that will happen for this pledge level is that the character illustration will be made and they'll get a print for it, and the character will be included in the expansion pack "when it's done" with no fixed ETA. I guess I need to be more clear that the completion of the expansion pack itself is not going to be part of the listed completion date.

Soulfinger wrote:
Drop lines like "I like this excerpt particularly since it really hits the mark:" from your review section. Obviously, you feel that way or you wouldn't include it. That's the point of an excerpt.

Done.

Soulfinger wrote:
This is a remarkably expensive game. You have the high funding goals of a KS that will fail the first time around and then do better the second time when production costs get reined in. For starters, you really don't need custom dice. We all want our ideas to be the prettiest girl at the prom, but the fact is that you are also hustling them on the street corner.

Prettiest prom girl hustling on a street corner.

Very fitting imagery for a dystopian world.

Soulfinger wrote:
You compromise your artistic integrity to demonstrate that you have the business sense to deliver a final product in a timely fashion at an affordable price. Why pay you all of this money when Netrunner is $30 at my local game store?

Nightlancer has much more content for £50 than Netrunner does for $30. Netrunner has about the same number of playing cards as Nightlancer, but nothing else. Nightlancer can be played with 3/4 players, or solitaire. It can be played cooperatively. It's got more action and depth.
(I haven't actually played Android: Netrunner, I've only played the original Netrunner, but afaik it's very similar?)

Are any of my points there wrong and/or not communicated effectively on the KS page?

I think just in terms of box content->price it's about right. I think I can follow through on entertainment->price too, but that's harder to convince prospective backers of. Hopefully the videos will cover that better when they're done (the recording session came up with some great footage).

I *could* run it with a price of £40, but that would require me to increase my goal (since to get to the same goal, I'd have to pay for more units to get printed and shipped). I don't know which of £40 or £50 is a good price point for this. I want to run it at £50 to see if it *can* succeed at that level. If it crashes and burns, I'll try again at a lower price.

I will look into ditching on custom-engraved/painted dice (I *do* need custom dice, but I'll see if I can find a cheaper way eg stickers or a just painted and not engraved)

Soulfinger wrote:
You are overextending yourself by running a competition. Were I backing your project, I'd feel like my money is being spent to cover the costs of dorks duct taping circuit boards to their elbows.

The total cost of the competition prizes, if they all get unlocked, is about £100 (maybe £150). Not even 1%.

I'm guessing that you realise that and are just giving the sort of quick immediate impression that a prospective backer who isn't reading too closely might give?

Yes, maybe this may put some people off, but if it increases visibility and gets more backers then it's a win overall. I don't know how effective it will be in increasing visibility, but then I don't know how many people will be put off by it either. My guess is it will help more than it hinders.

Soulfinger wrote:
Likewise, though your "What's Next" section lays out an ambitious plan for future releases, the pie chart for your budget doesn't reflect a strategy for growth. There is a point where listing off projects sounds less like future planning and veers into the realm of lack of focus on the task at hand. Keep it short.

Agreed. I can always do a backer update talking about expansion packs if backers are curious about it.

Soulfinger wrote:
Lastly, there is a lot about what you want to do and nothing about who you are. Backers need to know something about you and have a strong sense of your accountability and ownership of the project.

I'll work on that and update when I've added it.

iamseph wrote:That would be

iamseph wrote:
That would be misleading - selling out is a choice, not a necessity. I thought it was good to include emphasis on that in the headline, I think it's one of the more evocative parts.

Personally, I feel that an actively voiced declaration works out better than an interrogative sentence. Inevitability ("We're all going to die!") is more terse and evocative than choice ("Do you want to die?"), which emphasizes contemplation instead of a knee-jerk response. You are conveying the same message either way, that selling out gets you ahead, unless you add risk to the mix, "Risk selling out . . ." Either way, you can drop "values" as redundant, since the betrayal of self and others is inherently 'selling out.' It is less evocative when you limit it to just values and prevent people from reading into the term.

iamseph wrote:
It's true that people might see it as *just* a rehash, which is offputting. There are some fundamental differences in philosophy between NL and CP2020, but focusing on that isn't going to sell people on the game. I don't have a good answer here right now. I'll mull it over and get back to it later in the week.

You don't need to focus on it, because how many gamers even know about Cyberpunk 2020? Still, it doesn't hurt to consider what sets your game apart from the competition. Be ready to express it in bullet points. Shadowrun and Cyberpunk are fundamentally the same, but it is very easy to list off the differences. Even setting aside the fantasy elements, it is grim versus glam. The "rebel punk" and "dirty, bloodstained sheets" you mentioned conveys more to me than any list of factions.

Cyberpunk is poised to come back in a major way when CD Projekt finishes their digital RPG who knows how many years from now. If it gets the same traction as Witcher 3 then suddenly this venerable franchise could define teenage perceptions of the cyberpunk genre and renew some interest. The trailer suggests that cyberpsychosis is going to be a big part of the game.

iamseph wrote:
I guess I need to be more clear that the completion of the expansion pack itself is not going to be part of the listed completion date.

Most KS projects I've seen include the custom portraits as part of the existing game. I would bill it as a custom illustration. They get a print and special cards with their name and art included with their copy of the core game (or mailed separately). Avoid the long-term entanglements, because the last thing you want is a dozen bitchy ex-girlfriend proxies backing at this level cluttering up your comments threads with complaints of "He never delivered!" if your next KS is something other than the promised expansion.

iamseph wrote:
I think just in terms of box content->price it's about right. I think I can follow through on entertainment->price too, but that's harder to convince prospective backers of. Hopefully the videos will cover that better when they're done (the recording session came up with some great footage).

More and better images and a more fleshed out prototype will make a big difference. It helps to see a box. That reminds me, eliminate "will be" from your copy. They are 300 GSM cards with a matte finish, etc.

I only mean decreasing the cost of the game if you can rein in the production costs by eliminating extraneous features, not by dropping your profit margin. Revising things like the dice or the vacuum-formed tray should influence costs without changing the size of your run.

iamseph wrote:
Yes, maybe this may put some people off, but if it increases visibility and gets more backers then it's a win overall. I don't know how effective it will be in increasing visibility, but then I don't know how many people will be put off by it either. My guess is it will help more than it hinders.

I know nothing about cosplay past how to point and laugh, but I imagine that this gives you an in with promoting to that crowd were you to characterize it more as "Cyberpunk Cosplay" and hit up those forums. You'd also want to target the steampunk and post-apocalyptic crowds, maybe even leaving room for them to re-imagine your game in those terms.

Soulfinger wrote:Personally,

Soulfinger wrote:
Personally, I feel that an actively voiced declaration works out better than an interrogative sentence. Inevitability ("We're all going to die!") is more terse and evocative than choice ("Do you want to die?"), which emphasizes contemplation instead of a knee-jerk response. You are conveying the same message either way, that selling out gets you ahead, unless you add risk to the mix, "Risk selling out . . ." Either way, you can drop "values" as redundant, since the betrayal of self and others is inherently 'selling out.' It is less evocative when you limit it to just values and prevent people from reading into the term.

Right, I getcha.

Here's the new headline:
"A competitive cyberpunk game. Take underworld contracts to survive dystopian 2099. Sell out to get an edge but risk losing yourself."

Soulfinger wrote:
You don't need to focus on it, because how many gamers even know about Cyberpunk 2020? Still, it doesn't hurt to consider what sets your game apart from the competition. Be ready to express it in bullet points. Shadowrun and Cyberpunk are fundamentally the same, but it is very easy to list off the differences. Even setting aside the fantasy elements, it is grim versus glam. The "rebel punk" and "dirty, bloodstained sheets" you mentioned conveys more to me than any list of factions.

I think a key difference is, in SR and CP, the "big bad" is typically corrupt megacorps (to the point where megacorps are always corrupt). Such things do exist in NL, but authoritarian government and violation of freedom gets a lot more emphasis. I tried to focus a bit more on this in the new intro.

Speaking of which, new intro is now up.

Also:

Soulfinger wrote:
"dirty, bloodstained sheets"

Now the typo is on the other foot :P
That brings some ... different imagery to what I'm going for.

Soulfinger wrote:
Most KS projects I've seen include the custom portraits as part of the existing game. I would bill it as a custom illustration. They get a print and special cards with their name and art included with their copy of the core game (or mailed separately). Avoid the long-term entanglements, because the last thing you want is a dozen bitchy ex-girlfriend proxies backing at this level cluttering up your comments threads with complaints of "He never delivered!" if your next KS is something other than the promised expansion.

:/ awkward
I think getting into the future expansion pack is appealing (everyone I've mentioned it to has responded positively, idk if positive enough to pay for it, but positive)

but you're dead right that if I sell it in the wrong way and it's ambiguous what I'm committing to, there is a lot of potential for backers to feel that way

here's the current phrasing:
"In addition you may submit a concept (tweet-length) for a Nightlancer that will be created, and may also use your face for the design. You will receive a print of the Nightlancer design with your copy of the game. This Nightlancer will be used in an a future expansion pack, at a date to be determined."

Soulfinger wrote:
I imagine that this gives you an in with promoting to that crowd were you to characterize it more as "Cyberpunk Cosplay" and hit up those forums. You'd also want to target the steampunk and post-apocalyptic crowds, maybe even leaving room for them to re-imagine your game in those terms.

Good point. I'd thought about this on a smaller scale, I wasn't thinking big enough.

It would be a lot of wasted effort setting it up if the competition only gets 3 entrants, so I need to make sure it gets in front of enough people to spark it off.

iamseph wrote:Now the typo is

iamseph wrote:
Now the typo is on the other foot :P

Hah! I was mulling over a poem about hospitals. Had bedsheets on my mind.

iamseph wrote:Now the typo is

iamseph wrote:
Now the typo is on the other foot :P

Woops. My reply was so clever I posted it twice.

Broken link

The link doesn't work for me, it just redirects to the KS homepage.

Hmm

Hmm link doesn't seem to want to work.

Excellent advice thus far!

Joseph,

It appears as though Jonathan and Soulfinger have provided excellent, if a bit hypetbolic, advice. I'm away from a computer this week, so I'm seeing this only on my phone and clearly missing some of the finer points.

The artistry looks compelling, but the gameboard definitely requires the attention of a professional graphic artist before launching as it lacks, well, any manner of attention grabbing aspects. I can tell you from the experience of reviewing scores of rules, have them read often...by different individuals. They will look, I guarantee it, different (and better!) than they do now.

Good luck to you!

Cheers,
Joe

Syndicate content


gamejournal | by Dr. Radut