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Printers for production

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iamseph
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Joined: 09/02/2014

Hi all

I'm looking into printers for my game Nightlancer and I'm currently considering three possibilities: Whatz games, Ningbo Lijia and CPC (customized playing cards). I'm awaiting a quote from Panda but that wont happen until after gencon.

Has anyone worked with any of them before? Are there any particular problems I should look out for?

I've heard that working with chinese companies may introduce communication/language problems, but tbh my experience has been good so far. They seem thorough in checking that they understand correctly (and I check too) and don't seem to be a problem so far. Is there something I should look out for in the long run?

questccg
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Joined: 04/16/2011
Personally

The only issue I have with DIRECT dealing with Chinese Factories is that they can "cut" down on quality to try to save money. So you really need to know "your stuff" in every aspect of the printing. From double gummed paper to cardstock quality (Blue core, Black core, etc.) to chipboard sizes for tokens, game mats and boxes, etc. And even things like varnishing (do you want your box to be shiny or matte)?!?! What about your rulebook, what kind of paper thickness (in gsm), is it glossy, semi-glossy or matte?! Are the cover pages thicker than the rest (and therefore another quality of paper)?

The second issue I have is handling all the SHIPPING issues. Getting freight forwarders to deliver the palette from the dock to your home - is well something questionable. As I don't have experience in this, I have no idea about the COST of such an operation. I also don't know how to handle FOB transactions...

Why I would deal with CPC or AdMagic, would be simply because they will give me a FULL QUOTE, including the shipping to my doorstep (or fulfillment warehouse).

Those are my concerns when having to deal with DIRECT Chinese relations.

Update: I too have gotten some quotes from Chinese Manufacturers. And let me tell you, the break down ALL the components and charge for each one. And sometimes they play tricks like 4/0 for cards and quote that price... Of course if you want 4/4 the prices will be more expensive...

Things like that. Those kind of deals of breaking everything down makes for a more costly product. I even think DIRECT Chinese quotes were MORE expensive than CPC or AdMagic.

Also CPC allows you to order 500 units. That too is something to consider. The Chinese factories want 1,000 to 1,500 units (depending). One quote I got was for 2,500 units FOB. What does that mean? Less is probably MORE EXPENSIVE. And I asked for a quote of 1,000 units, they sent one for 2,500 units... Things like that.

Update #2: I have read that DIRECT Chinese products are sometimes of lesser quality than those made through a broker. Some Chinese factories have been known for producing lesser quality end-products. So buyer BE-WARE. Check out James Mathe website at:

http://www.jamesmathe.com/hitchhikers-guide-to-game-manufacturers/

Notice Wingo: "Card quality isn't great." and "Makes a decent product when you're very specific." Like I said you really need to KNOW your stuff.

Update #3: If you "haggle" with them... Then my concern would be they might "cut" some aspect of your product. Like my 4/0 example. If I would say I want 4/4 for the same price - IDK they may make a cheaper game box to balance out the deal... Believe me there are a LOT of details that you can just skip over. An example was "varnishing" the box cover? And what about the box bottom, do you also what it "varnished"???

Update #4: I got a quote from Ningbo Lijia. Here you can DOWNLOAD it and take a look at what I mean.

http://www.questccg.com/shared_info/Quotation_NingboLijia.xlsx

Update #5: Doing my own research, I should be able to get the game made for $4.00 USD. Now if I compute this spreadsheet to $9.26 USD... More than DOUBLE the amount AND that with the errors 4/0, need to be corrected. Also note that this is for 2,500 Game Sets!!! See what I mean?

I Will Never Gr...
I Will Never Grow Up Gaming's picture
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Joined: 04/23/2015
iamseph wrote:Hi all I'm

iamseph wrote:
Hi all

I'm looking into printers for my game Nightlancer and I'm currently considering three possibilities: Whatz games, Ningbo Lijia and CPC (customized playing cards). I'm awaiting a quote from Panda but that wont happen until after gencon.

Has anyone worked with any of them before? Are there any particular problems I should look out for?

I've heard that working with chinese companies may introduce communication/language problems, but tbh my experience has been good so far. They seem thorough in checking that they understand correctly (and I check too) and don't seem to be a problem so far. Is there something I should look out for in the long run?

Of those 3 I have only dealt with Whatz, though I have not had them manufacture anything to date.

Be very specific with what you want (if you need help, by all means ask us for help!) and make sure you send exactly the same information to all potential manufacturers.

Get a quote from a dozen manufacturers. Better to have too many than too few.

As for language barriers, I have yet to have any with the factories I've dealt with. Sure, sometimes you can tell their English is weaker than others, but in general it's not an issue when you're dealing with technical specifications.

Ask what their MOQ is (Minimum Order Quantity). If it's higher than you like, pass on that factory. Many have moved to a 500 MOQ from what used to be a 1000-2500 MOQ.

Ask if their quote includes a shipping estimate (shipping can't be accurately quoted until manufacturing is near completion, but they can give you a rough guess or a range) and if it's FOB (their location) or FOB (your location); usually it will be FOB their location (meaning once it leaves the factory it's all your responsibility, including if anything goes wrong in transit).

Have them break the quote down into component costs. This does not increase the cost of your product, but it will let you know where you could potentially cut costs if needed. Not all will do this, but most will.

Ask if their quote includes an Overs charge. This can be as much as 10% (basically they make more than requested and you get charged for it. This covers damages and errors)

That's all I can think of off the top of my head.

I Will Never Gr...
I Will Never Grow Up Gaming's picture
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Joined: 04/23/2015
A quick list of manufacturers

A quick list of manufacturers I have been in contact with for reference;

AdMagic (expensive, US company)
Panda (slow because they're so busy, high quality, high price, high MOQ)
QPC Games (fast communication, high priced)
Whatz Games (Fast communication, decent price)
WinGo (decent communication, decent price)
Kammings Trade Co
Longpack
MPC (somewhat high priced, don't have the range of products I needed but may for your project).

I've also been in contact with the manufacturer that Mayday Games, AEG, Cryptozoic and GameWright use but I don't have an actual manufacturer name though, just the person who does the quotes for me (their prices are decent though).

Wendyzhu
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Joined: 12/21/2012
Ningbo Lijia and Lijia Game

Ningbo Lijia is the holding company of Lijia Game Production. They are the partner for Hasbro, Gamewright, AEG, Manticgames, etc.
There are a video showing their procedure of game manufacturing for some top branded games:
http://www.lijiagames.com/our_team

Glass shoe games
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Joined: 02/28/2017
I would check out print

I would check out print Ninja. They gave me really good quotes. Also they will send you demo copies of games they have done before.

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