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Help in adding Strategy/Depth

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 17:02
#31
questccg
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I already mentioned this ... But here's a 2nd try...

Westmaas wrote:
Looking for advice on another couple of dilemmas as well...

I'm trying to incorporate a good defensive card to the game, called FIREWALL. The current iteration has some flaws unfortunately...

Here's my advice concerning the FIREWALL card. Instead of playing it at "some random time" (see there are more flaws than you think...) you can play it as a "cancel" card. So, if someone plays a card AGAINST YOU, you can instantly play the "FIREWALL" card which blocks the opponent's ACTION.

See the thing is how do you know WHEN to play the "FIREWALL" card (in your version)??? So what it protects you one round. What does that even MEAN?! What are you protecting from and what are the guarantees that will be the outcome and again (more flaws) so you skip a turn and then the next turn the opponent can play whatever it was you were TRYING to STOP in the earlier turn (Bet you that you did not see that one either!!!)

Using the "FIREWALL" card as a CANCEL/BLOCK is immediately RELEVANT and serves a DIRECT purpose in that it "counters" an opposing card/action.

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 18:33
#32
Westmaas
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questccg wrote:Westmaas

questccg wrote:
Westmaas wrote:
Looking for advice on another couple of dilemmas as well...

I'm trying to incorporate a good defensive card to the game, called FIREWALL. The current iteration has some flaws unfortunately...

Here's my advice concerning the FIREWALL card. Instead of playing it at "some random time" (see there are more flaws than you think...) you can play it as a "cancel" card. So, if someone plays a card AGAINST YOU, you can instantly play the "FIREWALL" card which blocks the opponent's ACTION.

See the thing is how do you know WHEN to play the "FIREWALL" card (in your version)??? So what it protects you one round. What does that even MEAN?! What are you protecting from and what are the guarantees that will be the outcome and again (more flaws) so you skip a turn and then the next turn the opponent can play whatever it was you were TRYING to STOP in the earlier turn (Bet you that you did not see that one either!!!)

Using the "FIREWALL" card as a CANCEL/BLOCK is immediately RELEVANT and serves a DIRECT purpose in that it "counters" an opposing card/action.

Haha thanks for addressing this problem again, I appreciate it! I know we had talked about it earlier, and I definitely see how the card being a reactive CANCEL/BLOCK effect works best :)

The only reason I brought it up again is because I’ve really been searching for a way to have this card used ON someone’s turn, not OUT of turn, for a couple of reasons: 1, sometimes people forget they are holding it and don’t play when they should, only to regret it later, and 2 - If it is only a reactive card, then there could be a possibility where someone is left holding FIREWALL and PASSCODE as their only 2 cards left - and since FIREWALL can only be played in response to someone else’s attack on them, they wouldn’t be able to play anything on their turn which would leave them paralyzed indefinitely.

I guess one way to fix this could be to incorporate an earlier idea of yours, where perhaps this card has 2 effects that a player can choose: 1 could be to cancel/block an incoming attack, OR the player could discard the card to no effect... but I believe that having 1 universal effect for the card would be better, something that can CANCEL/BLOCK but can also operate on it’s own somehow, so that a player isn’t trapped with no option to play a card on their turn...

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 18:54
#33
questccg
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Well maybe you can combine BOTH uses...?

Like say this is your LAST TURN and you have BOTH the "Firewall" and the "Passcode". The two (2) effects of the card are:

  1. Instantly Block an opponent's card/action by playing this card.

  2. Play this card down in play to protect your hand during the next round.

This means that IF you only had 2 cards, the "Firewall" and the "PASSCODE", you could use Option #2 and play it ... Such that on your next turn you can PLAY the "PASSCODE" and WIN?!

Doesn't this sound like a win-win scenario? I'm just saying that your #1 and #2 Actions can be "similar" in Function but sufficiently different that they DON'T mess-up the "core" gameplay.

What do you think of this??? And BTW you've never signed any of your messages... What's your First Name? I ask only because we've been dialog-ing together on this thread for maybe a month ... And I don't know who you are... Usually someone will mention -Scott or Thx Jack ... etc.

You can PM-me if you prefer to keep your identity anonymous... No worries. I just like to put a person to an alias (for improved/better camaraderie)... Cheers!

Note #1: I only say this because it's been cool (I think all our contributors will agree) helping you out. Plus you keep us informed about decisions you are making ... That's pretty neat too.

Just to explain... Some people ask for advice and then disappear for 2 months and ... we all (regulars) wonder where the heck did they go?!

Or they post and never return for feedback... Sure some people anonymously read threads ... That much I know. So some people want to keep total anonymity. And while that is fine... It's not as interesting as getting feedback from the Designer (him/herself).

Anyhow it's been cool helping you out. You actually provide feedback. This I like, no that won't work, this is now an issue, yeah that solved it, etc. You don't know how many threads we comment on and get no response. Really you'd be amazed on how little feedback some people give.

Again it's everyone's right to use this forum as they see fit. I'm just saying with your game ... It's been cool and enjoyable (not like pulling teeth) lol

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 23:02
#34
Westmaas
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Ah thanks a lot for the kind

Ah thanks a lot for the kind words! My thoughts are the same - it’s been highly enjoyable gaining advice, feedback and ideas through this forum, everyone on here is super helpful and it’s been an invaluable source of information! It’s already helped me so much with insight on how to improve the game, and I’ve been playtesting a lot since the thread began. I wish we could upload pics because the art is looking really cool too, I’ll have to put it up on a website sometime for everyone to see.

I never intended to be anonymous haha! My name’s Christopher, good to meet you and the rest of the community. I can’t thank everyone enough for all the input etc, it’s been fun checking the thread and seeing the new advice crop up.

I think FIREWALL can definitely work as you stated above - having two different conditions should be fine, even though it may be the only card of it’s kind to have the dual option available.

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 23:12
#35
Westmaas
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One of the last dilemmas I’m

One of the last dilemmas I’m hung up on is the VIRUS card. In it’s current iteration, it’s effect is “Choose an agent. They must discard a file into the memory bank.” So basically it forces another player to burn a card. This is fine, and is a good card to have if holding the PASSCODE, because you might be able to reduce another opponents hand down to 1, which would trigger the round end.

My only thinking is, I could easily give this effect to a different card, and perhaps come up with something more thematic for VIRUS. An initial thought was a card that could only be given, not taken, but that could create an infinite loop of people just passing the VIRUS card around without any resolution. Another thought would be that it forces an opponent to reveal their entire domain to everyone... but not sure if that fits the virus theme either. Just looking for any cool ideas that may spring up...

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 23:14
#36
questccg
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You know what is DIFFICULT???

Making "Abilities" and corresponding cards for our games. You've got a cyberpunk theme with hacking and cracking... And a volume of techie words. So, you can borrow the words that you like and try to create "Abilities" for them...

For me it's different. I have an Ethereal Gateway of Interconnections to different location in the known Realm. And so I don't have a BANK of reserved or theme-specific terms. It makes it so much harder to think up of "Abilities" that work with the various elements in the game ... And not only that... How to broaden the POOL of "Abilities" such that there is the potential of expandability. If that makes sense?!

Anyway if you have some art to show... That too would be COOL! Would like to see what kind of style fits "Passcode"! Cheers.

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 23:17
#37
Westmaas
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Wow yeah that definitely

Wow yeah that definitely makes it much more difficult! Computers and cyberpunk style genre has so many terms to reference which definitely makes it easier than normal. But, there’s something uniquely cool about having a strange and weird game like yours where you are forced to explore the depths of your imagination for exotic abilities and titles!

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Fri, 12/18/2020 - 23:29
#38
questccg
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Here are some more ideas you can fleshed out...

Westmaas wrote:
One of the last dilemmas I’m hung up on is the VIRUS card.

Right away I think of TWO (2) Possible cards: VIRUS and MALWARE.

VIRUS: could be like a Backdoor or Trojan. So some kind of "infiltration" type of card. IDK TBH exactly ... I'm just presenting ideas you can flush out further...

MALWARE: could be like Tracking or Keylogger. In this case a form of "espionage". Again just some "broad" ideas.

Having said this... Maybe VIRUS can COUNTER a "FIREWALL". So Player 1 plays Card #1 on Player 2 and he responds with a "FIREWALL" and then Player 1 counters with a VIRUS...

Maybe something Take-That which is a bit FUN!

And MALWARE could be something like "Show your hand to that opponent".

IDK ... I'm a bit "dried-up" at the moment. Had a LONG DAY. My CAR BATTERY died on me this morning, had to reschedule my plans from morning to later afternoon. The boost truck came around 12:00 PM and it took about 15 minutes too boost the car. Then I had to drive it to the garage since the boost truck said my battery is FINISHED... And yeah kudos to him the battery was indeed finished. Drove the car to the garage. Took them another 30 minutes. But it cost me like $300.00 for the battery including the testing and installation (+Taxes on top of all of that). Grrr...

I'll think about it over the weekend and get back to you. Maybe some better ideas might pop-up... Never know!

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Sat, 12/19/2020 - 19:17
#39
Westmaas
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questccg wrote:Right away I

questccg wrote:

Right away I think of TWO (2) Possible cards: VIRUS and MALWARE.

VIRUS: could be like a Backdoor or Trojan. So some kind of "infiltration" type of card. IDK TBH exactly ... I'm just presenting ideas you can flush out further...

MALWARE: could be like Tracking or Keylogger. In this case a form of "espionage". Again just some "broad" ideas.

Having said this... Maybe VIRUS can COUNTER a "FIREWALL". So Player 1 plays Card #1 on Player 2 and he responds with a "FIREWALL" and then Player 1 counters with a VIRUS...

Maybe something Take-That which is a bit FUN!

And MALWARE could be something like "Show your hand to that opponent".

IDK ... I'm a bit "dried-up" at the moment. Had a LONG DAY. My CAR BATTERY died on me this morning, had to reschedule my plans from morning to later afternoon. The boost truck came around 12:00 PM and it took about 15 minutes too boost the car. Then I had to drive it to the garage since the boost truck said my battery is FINISHED... And yeah kudos to him the battery was indeed finished. Drove the car to the garage. Took them another 30 minutes. But it cost me like $300.00 for the battery including the testing and installation (+Taxes on top of all of that). Grrr...

I'll think about it over the weekend and get back to you. Maybe some better ideas might pop-up... Never know!

Sorry to hear about the car trouble the other day! Enjoy the weekend and thanks again for all the help. The back and forth take-that style card play is always fun, so maybe I'll incorporate something like that. MALWARE could be a cool tracking idea... like maybe a player chooses a card from an opponent, and they have to flip the card around in their hand so that it's identity is always visible to the other players haha... just a fun out of the box idea.

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Sat, 12/19/2020 - 20:08
#40
questccg
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Always pays to think thing through...

I got an idea about the "MALWARE" card: it forces a player to show the adjacent files in your hand. The opponent who knows what player HAS the MALWARE card asks him to reveals the files adjacent to the MALWARE card in his/her hand. When it is at either end of a hand, the player only reveals one (1) file, anywhere else it reveals two (2) files. That sort of like some "espionage" and it matters where the card is in your hand. You need to reveal "one" or "two" files to the opponent.

After that you GIVE the MALWARE card to the player who used it against you! (Now he's infected and the others know they can use the card).

But maybe have some COMBO if you have BOTH the VIRUS and MALWARE, you get a CRASH (System failure of some sorts)... And you SKIP your turn. Something funny like that!

Cheers!

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Fri, 01/22/2021 - 17:39
#41
Westmaas
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Thanks for the MALWARE idea!

Thanks for the MALWARE idea! That's definitely thinking outside of the box, I love it. I've been doing a bunch of playtesting and have whittled it down to a good set of cards and ideas now - I'll let you know how it all goes, and maybe post a site so everyone can see the results!

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