How to approach RETAIL sales???

I don't disagree. But the whole IDEA behind the Booster Packs was to make some extra monies and yes it's from TGC... I wanted to start small with my Chinese contacts and move forwards from there. So yeah, I wanted this next game to be mostly made in the USA followed by the custom D6s made in China (and there are many reasons for this not just one...)

Actually the Booster Packs is what was supposed to be the "extra revenue" generator. The "core" set only features a rulebook, dry ink pen, 3 custom dice and a medium bag with crystals. At TGC that costs me $10.50 USD. I mean is anyone going to be willing to pay MORE than $10 USD for a bag with gems?!?! TBH I'm a bit disappointed ATM. It puts the entire project at jeopardy. IDK anymore.

Can't do squat until TradeWorlds is fulfilled and shipped. But we are nearing the Production/Sample stage with that game. We're looking to make a final decision on the manufacturer in the next 2 weeks (before Christmas).

The problem in my area is that many of the French Owners want to buy from French Designers. English in Quebec have little to no representation in this industry. Most of the retailers are in small towns outside of Montreal and there are around 200+ stores scattered around the province. The BEST bet in my area is to SELL to either of the TWO (2) Distributors... Because then there is no more French issue... You are buying through your preferred sales channel.

And they all buy from those two (2) distributors which also have a presence in Ontario and I believe B.C. (not 100% sure TBH).

But really all I am trying to do TODAY is to figure what are my options. And TBH, I'm not seeing any REAL future in the retail or distribution sectors.

And this is a fault with TGC... The pricing is too HIGH to get into distribution and as far as RETAIL goes... Like I said, they mostly prefer to buy from distributors.

I just don't see much BEYOND the KS ... And that to me SIGNALS a "big problem"...! Sure my company might make $5k USD which is all real nice... Not having a RETAIL or future market strategy really pains me. It basically says that my ONLY Avenue is Kickstarter and afterwards no possibility of growing the brand ... Because with TGC pricing, there is no way to support middlemen only Designer/TGC Manufacturer.

I've still got time to figure things out. I'm going to do some NEW playtesting over the weekend with "Crystal Heroes" and considering that I haven't playtested the game for a while, I want to TEST the latest crystal/pouch quantities... I've opting to RID myself of the 1 Player set and sell two (2) options: a 2 Player Duel and a 4 Multi-Player Game.

I also need to review my KS projections... With *NEW* pricing and format.

It's one thing to RID yourself of a Reward Tier... Another thing is to retrofit your plans (in terms of customer offer) such that the venture is a success using the newer pricing and format.

I need some more time to process and re-think what to do AFTERWARDS. Right now with the new pricing and format, I need to re-evaluate the KS and see the success levels (minimums). After that is done... Well then I can see how to move forwards again.

Don't worry... I just need some time to re-think things a bit.

Look I know that going to China is a big difference. The real ISSUE is that I don't want to do everything in ONE (1) single pass. The idea was to use "The Game Crafter" to have my game MADE IN THE USA and have custom d6s to be made in China and inserted during manufacturing. It's as simple as that.

TGC is a great service ... But there are facets which are still a bit, how to say it... "questionable". Things like getting *NICE* in normal colors (Rounded 16mm d6s) is still not available, you only have the cheap-@ss ones (squared ones) which look so unprofessional it's not funny.

The custom d6 option costs $5.00 for screen-printing per die.

So the goal is to do EVERYTHING TGC does AMAZINGLY and add $0.25 for the custom Engraved d6s (Made in China)...

I'm not finished YET... I still have some ideas to focus on the KS ... And from there see what can be done afterwards. But it's Baby steps! First we KS, then we make the game via TGC and then figure out what happens AFTERWARDS!

Thank you for all your insight... I will consider a better multiplier (7x to 10x multiplier) too. Again one thing at a time. Cheers!

It sounds a bit disheartening... I've heard that Amazon charges crazy prices for floorspace during the Christmas prelude (October-December)... And that overall Amazon is "hard" to make money because of all the fees and associated costs that go into having inventory to sell on Amazon.

But just to help the two of you out... Before FBA, sellers used to DROPSHIP their items once they received news of a sale. Now I can't remember with whom I had this conversation with... But someone told me they do STILL offer the "dropship" method, however FBA is preferred because Amazon makes more money using FBA and offers customers incentives like 2 Day Delivery to Prime Members, etc.

However the "dropship" method allows you to warehouse your stock wherever you like and when you get a sale, you ship it to the location. Since you guys are use QML, my guess is that you are already "dropshipping" your games. Correct?!

Sorry I could not help more... That's the only information that I have: stay away from FBA because of the even higher fees during the Holiday Season and use the "dropship" method to still allow you game to be sold from Amazon.

In any event... Having your product for SALE on Amazon is GOOD... Because everyone goes to Amazon to SEARCH FIRST and then given that price look around and see IF they can BUY DIRECT too. That's the other nugget I got about Amazon: your consumer doesn't need to BUY it on Amazon. All he/she needs to do is FIND IT. As such your Amazon PRICE should be HIGHER than say a DIRECT Website sale (from your own website). That's something else that I was told about "dropshipping": the best way is to sell via your website and dropship from a US warehouse.

So, your Amazon PRICE should be "higher" than the price on your website. There are some good principle to consumerism in this. 1> You make sure your product is VISIBLE on Amazon, 2> This means that the consumer will be encouraged to do a price comparison on several sources 3> Offer a good deal from your own website (bypassing the Amazon fees and such) 4> You make the consumer feel "smart" in that he found a DEAL!

Anyhow maybe this can help the two of you... Cheers!

I think it depends WHERE you actually want to SELL! Like in @Jay103 case, a RPG game might NOT sell well at Walmart. Online sales give him 100% MSRP and allow him to warehouse the games where ever he chooses. Whereas @Evans game which is more mainstream, may do well in Walmart especially NEXT to a Monopoly game. I'm not stating this as FACTS ... Just observations.

Also getting one SKU into Walmart may be easier than several like in @Jay103 case since he has 2 SKUs: a "core" game and an "expansion". I personally can't see Walmart selling an "expansion"... This to me works best in FLGSs, ONLINE or Hobby Stores only. Actually come to think of it... Maybe ONLY ONLINE. Why? Well it seems if you can get the "core" into stores, you won't need DOUBLE the shelf space if you offer the expansion online only...

For the real FAN ... Online purchases can be an excellent way of getting more entrenched with the Brand ... But is this all people??? Probably no. IMHO the online sales of "expansions" is an EXCELLENT way to push more product to the FANS. It doesn't bog down stores who have limited store shelving for say only one product (especially when competing with all the other Brands/games).

And that's kinda what you want with a "core" game: to be "Evergreen".

Expansions can be sold online with all kinds of other possibilities for the FANS of the "core" game. But STORE customers will probably be from "core" sales... If you use this kind of RETAIL strategy.

It gives me MORE to think about. I'm really glad I brought this topic up. It seems to be interesting and it has helped me too. A couple nights ago, I supped up "Crystal Heroes" (CH) and made some very WISE choices for that game... Much thanks to this thread which woke me up when it came to retailing and what were the avenues and which could be a possible PATH for games with HIGH COSTS (such as the ones produced by The Game Crafter).

I say HIGH, what I mean is PRICEY-ER costs. Not prohibitive or exorbitant ones... Just ones that make TRADITIONAL retailing hard. Anyhow ... I will continue to research this further and if anyone else cares to comment please feel free to do so!

I can get it lowered by $0.53 between 1 and 100. So not too large of a savings, but if I project on the top price... I just make extra with some volume.

I think the variance is much lower nowadays on TGC. It seems like the pricing per unit is lower and that the discounts for volume are also lower.

For me it's not just a question of price. TGC has one of the simplest and the most flexible Pack Randomizer... That allows you so much flexibility. JT personally explained and showed me how to use it even better than other randomized techniques.

It's real cool... You can define 5 categories for random cards, then you can specify the number of cards in each one of the categories and then you can allow or deny duplicates and then when you add cards you can do duplicates too... To give you even finer or more granular control.

For example, I can have a category called Rare. And say I want 1 out of 10 to be a Mythic card. All I do is add 9 doubles and only 1 Mythic. So I can have Rares PLUS a random Mythic. And I can control the odds and randomization.

Doing that with sheets and card counts is a real pain in the @$$. TGC makes it so simple. I have ONLY 15 unique cards plus 10 stat randomized cards... And with ONLY that I can SELL boosters. I'm not saying people will buy 100 packs... But maybe 5 to 10 could be possible.

That's probably because you've never explored booster packs and boxes. I can't imagine how difficult it would be using sheets and calculating card counts. I've spoken with Wendy and she told me different paper, different card counts.

For example, German black core is 54 per sheet, Chinese black core is 80 per sheet.

I just can't imagine how complicated it would be to have 5 categories of cards PLUS add to this a random chase card and then a static card. Just too complicated. With TGC it is so simple...

But as you know, the costs are higher. Anyhow, we'll see how the KS goes first and then I can see what kind of RETAIL strategy I can use...

Note #1: I realize why my COST break for bulk is not that high: I only have 14 cards per Pack. So there is a small discount for the cards and another small discount for the Packaging (Hook Box). If I had more cards, maybe the discount would be more significant and I'd have to use something like a Poker Tuck Box.

The answer lies in the Deck Construction mechanic. So I wanted players to build their own decks. But at the same time, I wanted it to be easy to understand HOW you do this.

And the answer is simple. There are 4 categories (A000, B000, C000 and D000). You must choose 3 cards in each category.

It's as SIMPLE as that. Cards are designed to be compatible per Block. This means that children can customize with the Heroes they prefer while adults and teens can make more detailed analysis to figure out which cards they want to play with.

Same thing with NEW players. It's not hard to understand what cards are good together and how you can build a balanced deck of tiles...

So there is a real reason for this kind of distribution. It's to simplify things but still offer experts the option to go even further and make a balanced Deck (with the 4 Blocks).

Note #1: Like I said for *NEW* players, all you need to do is PICK 3 cards for each of the 4 Blocks and your deck is BALANCED. Well yes it is probably possible to build a better than average deck if you go deeper into each of the game's tiles... But generally speaking, all you need is 3 x 4 = 12 cards and you can play "equally" well (as I would say)!