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Subversiva CCG - Template wanted

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eyerouge
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Joined: 07/30/2008
template prototype

We're a free pro non-commercial on- and off-line CCG project that's still looking for a person that knows his/her photoshop/illustrator or equivalent and that wants to help us out by creating a card template for Subversiva, the game we're creating which can be found at http://www.subversiva.org

. Gary S. started working on the attached template but he seems to have vanished and we lack the orginal files, so we're back at square one.

Please take a look at our site - we have potential and have some great artists with us, but we still need the template to get things moving, so if you're interested in helping out somehow with the template (or otherwise) please contact me by mailing contact(at)subversiva.org or share your thoughts / questions in here.

Thanks.

Addiso
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Joined: 07/27/2008
a few questions

Can you attach a document or post the size of the cards, intended resolution and colorspace (CMYK/RGB) items needed on the cards, and a list of the signs/symbols on them ? Do you have a set color theme or any other graphic guidelines ?

eyerouge
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Joined: 07/30/2008
Addiso: Thanks for your

Addiso:

Thanks for your interest :) I'll try to answer your questions to the best of my ability.

1. Size & resolutions

The size of the cards in the online version of the game will be around 312x446 px at 72 dpi. The very exact pixel count isn't of importance to use, but something like that would be the desired size and also something along that proportion between width and height. The reason for why we can't have better resolutions for the online game are a) the resolution of the artwork we're going to use on the different cards b) file sizes c) there is no reason to have larger images of a card, at least not for playing.

The size of the cards in the offline version should be whatever the size of normal CCG cards is (or rather, whatever fits in standard plastic CCG sleeves, aka transparent card/deckprotectors from e.g. Upper Deck, while leaving some millimeters of the top so the card doesn't fall out or get damaged by usage). As a reference we should use the card dimensions found in e.g. Magic: The Gathering. Since I'm not currently at home I can't give you the exact dimensions for you. I have however noticed that most card sleeves actually allow larger cards to be put in them than the dimensions in MTG, at least a few millimeters wider and higher. I think we should take that into account and maximize the card area - as long as it fits in the standard sleeves and there's no problem putting it them - we're happy.

Because most players would either use a color printer at home or a professional photo lab to get hold of the cards, and because real life CCG cards are pretty small, I think we would probably be able to settle with a non-superlarge resolution. It only depends on how it would look like when printed out/developed. If it looks good and pro to the naked eye it is all good and we'd settle for it. Again, what I've sent in to the photo lab came back in excellent quality when I held the card in my hand even if was somewhat interpolated (due to the original card art for that specific card, and not because of template reasons.) It was fully comparable with professional products.

If you happen to use Illustrator or something else and work with vector graphics, these questions won't be an issue of course. If you don't, I'd need to get back to you with the specifics of my files when I get home on Saturday, 2:nd of August, and you'd know the values I used and which came back great.

2. Colourspace
This isn't my expertise and I don't know which would be best. As mentioned, the users would get hold of the cards either in the online game or as downloadable sorted images which they can print out or take to a photolab to develop them. Much of the original card art is however casual jpg/bmp files etc, and I'd guess that it's RGB then. I also don't know what would happen if we have a CMYK template and place a casual JPG in it where the artwork is supposed to show. Hence, I'd leave this up to you to decide.

3. Items needed on the cards

This is what must be laid out somehow:

- Container for card name
- Area for the card art we get from the other artists.
- A container for ranged attack and one for ranged defense (this could possibly be the same container depending on a lot of stuff)
- Same as in 3 but for close combat
- Container for the cards type, subtype, (race etc)
- Container for the card text
- Container for action point cost
- The same for gold cost
- Somewhere to put the cards faction, as a symbol

If you look at the sample template that Gary made in the first post (click the small image or download the attachment) you'll see that purple 2 is action point cost, 9 the gold cost, 10 & 12 the attacks, and 6 & 1 the defenses. Nevermind the 11, it just shows there is more room to use on the card. The 13 would be replaced by the factions symbol.

I think the above covers the basics and what would probably be the most crammed up card type: The creature cards.

4. Icons & Symbols
There are none at the moment, and even if there were there should be an easy way to insert them into the template after it's been finished. It has been suggested, in a lenghty discussion in this forum (the old actually) that icons should be used to represent the different attack types/defenses and the goldcost and actionpoints. An example of icons used for gold and action points can be seen in Garys template. He did however not finish creating the rest, nor is it apparent to me where they'd be placed in a smooth way while at the same time filling their function.

Except for those symbols and possibly a handful others (not on the creature card though) there won't be any more of them. Since we don't have the symbols we'd have to add them at a later point or offer you the glory to create them ;) In either case the symbols would always be as simple and clear as possible, if possible at all that is. They should also not be more sophisticated than the ones found in the example template.

4. Theme
There is no set theme and there are no graphic guidelines except for my amateur discussion and feeble attempt which can be seen in here >> http://chaosrealm.net/subversiva/?p=45 ..and which is by now also discarded as the crap it was. I have the original photoshop files for it, if you by any chance want them for any reason, shout and I'll send or upload.

Instead, I'd say that Gary's template is very spot on what should be "duplicated". If it wasn't for him disappearing and us not having the originals we'd probably use his template already as it seemed very fine and almost done. The plan was to change some minor things on it for the other card types, and they'd be done as well.

Since this version of Subversiva is the fantasy one, the colours would of course not be neon bright - they should look fantasyish, รก la Garys example. Backgrounds should stay on the background etc. If you layer everything properly re-colouring should also be easy to do in case we'd need to adjust something. As a matter of fact, that goes for everything else on the template as well.

When it comes to appearance it would be just fine if you reproduced Garys prototype from the first post. It would of course be equally fine if you came with a suggestion of your own - it's really totally up to you. If you do have some wild and innovative suggestion then please let's discuss it by looking at sketches before you put down time and effort into it. If not, go with Garys as the "base" of operations.

5. Contact
We should hook up, that way we'd save a lot of time and fix all things needed. My msn is: subcodes (at) hotmail.com. My jabber and also my email: eyerouge (at) gmail.com ... Feel free to contact me any time. Looking forward to hearing from you and appreciate the read.

apeloverage
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Joined: 08/01/2008
you described your project

(both here and on the site), as both 'pro' and 'non-commercial'.

What do you mean by 'pro'?

eyerouge
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Joined: 07/30/2008
Interesting, you're the first

Interesting, you're the first to react... =) (but that's a good thing maybe).

Pro is usually an abbreviation for "professional".

a) In this case the word is used in a general sense: The projects goal is to offer an end product that is, at least i part, the result of professionals working together, supposedly making the likelihood that the end product is decent somewhat higher. (And yes, there is no guarantee we'd end up with a good game no matter what crew we have)

b) Pro is also often used to underline that x is "serious" or at least fulfills some kind of expected quality standards. In this specific case, again in general, it would be the industry standards of the average CCG. In other words, the ones MTG sets the limits for. Such standards also say something not only about the release of the game but also about the plans for the community, competitions, rulings, further rule revisions etc etc.

c) In the spirit of the above paragraph pro can also be seen as some kind of statement that this is not an average game project (pardon my expression, I know this place has high standards in general and pro is less meaningful in here than the rest of the world) that won't go anywhere and that e.g. resources, in form of x y z, will be spent on it. I believe it can maybe indicate dedication and the will to complete what's been started, and that we try to have a certain attitude while working where the game itself is in focus and not the will of a benevolent developer ;)

Pick any of the above, but beware that they overlap partially. Pro might not really be a good word to use as I agree that it is fuzzy. With that said however, it might still bring something to the description of the project's spirit, whatever the end result may be. ; )

Personally I'm not that interested in semantics when it comes to describing a game, at least not in a stage where it's not released yet. It will be a more pressing matter later on.

Could I have picked another snappy (better) word that tries to catch the interest of the reader and still keeping the text minimal? Sure, English isn't even my native languager and I've done 99% of the text work han-solo, which shows of course since I don't master the lingo.

Am I open for suggestions? Do I want more people that are better than me in English to help out? Of course! I'd love 'em - hence your thoughts are appreciated and noted, also the future ones.

I hope this answered your question, and please don't misread "pro" as me being cocky ;) In my mind it's very hard to distinguish some concepts from others, so one would have to speak of specific perspectives of qualities one is comparing/looking at. Meanwhile: See it as a marketing gimmick for the project.

Edit >>

Non-commercial simply means that we're not a company and aren't interested or allowed to sell the game and that it is free to obtain. I have put down time and effort to explain the term in the developers rules and it is ezplained in great detail. I'm sure you'll like it ; ) if you take a look at http://subversiva.org/rules.pdf ..at least on the pages 5 to 7.

apeloverage
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Joined: 08/01/2008
I'd use

'professional-quality' or something similar.

apeloverage
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Joined: 08/01/2008
You might want to look at

http://www.dvorakgame.co.uk , particularly

http://www.dvorakgame.co.uk/index.php/Chronogeddon_CCG_card_set

That was a similar project which seems to have run out of steam.

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