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Ever feel like a copycat??

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Anonymous

Hi folks,

I'm relatively new here and I apologize if a topic like this one has been covered before. I've finally decided to try my hand at designing my first game, and I have a solid idea for the theme I'm pursuing. I also have a good idea of the types of goals and activities I want to include in the game.

My problem is that developing the mechanics is beginning to make me feel like I have zero original ideas. As a rough example, I've toyed with the idea of including an auction round followed by an action round. Well, it didn't take long fleshing that out before I realized I was treading very closely to Princes of Florence (a game I really enjoy). Further, when brainstorming auction mechanics I kept coming back to familiar mechanisms like those found in Modern Art or other published titles.

I guess my newbie question is: How do you avoid becoming a copycat? Even when bouncing ideas off of my wife, she'll point out that it's similar to another game we've played. I want to do something worthwhile and not just cobble together good mechanics from various other games. I know I have original ideas floating around in the mix, but where is the line for everyone between inspiration and duplication?

Is it maybe better to establish a good, solid and original mechanic and then retrofit the theme? Beginning with the theme and finding mechanics to fit it seems to be leading me down paths that are too familiar.

Thanks in advance!!

-42-

Anonymous
Ever feel like a copycat??

Hi,

Not that I'm a prolific designer with scads of games to my name but I really think that you could do worse than to put together a few ideas that tread on the line of being another already produced game. (they don't have to be on the market games... just practice) The thing to remember is that you're exercising your creative juices and not making a mint off someone elses sweat. Keep putting ideas out and fleshing them a bit. Sooner or later you'll find something creeping out that doesn't ring a bell as a game you've just played. Keep a diary of your game ideas... or a folio or whatever... keep track of your thoughts cause it's really easy to lose them once you've let them go.

Good luck!

Mike

Scurra
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Ever feel like a copycat??

There are no original mechanics :-) Just like there aren't any original stories. What matters is the way they are fitted together. Princes of Florence wasn't the first game to have an auction round followed by an actions round after all.
Likewise, don't worry that there are a limited pool of auction types: Modern Art came out a decade ago and people haven't stopped making auction games, have they?

It certainly helps to have a USP* for your game, but the quality of the experience is more important. If the players are having fun, they are unlikely to care if they can see which games the various aspects came from (and often they will have no idea anyway!)

(*a Unique Selling Point is useful but sometimes it's an impediment if it prevents the design from developing properly: I consider the "dice tower" in Wallenstein to be a good example of this; it's a great concept but flawed and I think it has an adverse effect on the game as a result.)

jwarrend
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Ever feel like a copycat??

I agree with David, I think that many of the great games of the last few years prove that you can make a great game without an original mechanic -- Puerto Rico is a perfect example. Of course, I think the reason games like PR get away with being unoriginal is because they work so very well. So that's kind of the trick; if you're going to borrow, you also have to improve on what's already out there. You want to be blending existing mechanics in a way that creates a game play that feels different from other games. A great example is the evolution of the "role selection mechanic" from Verrater to Citadels to Puerto Rico. All were based on the same concept, but the implementation is very different in each game.

Also, broad classifications of mechanics like "auctions" or "set collections" hardly count as borrowing, because they're so common to so many games. So I wouldn't worry about that a bit.

I think the best starting point for a designer is really just to try to design games that work well and are fun to play. That's plenty of a challenge without being original! Having said that, as a designer, I prize originality pretty highly, and rarely borrow existing mechanics if I can create my own. In that sense, new mechanics are what I consider to be my games' "unique selling points", and I agree with David that every game has to have something that distinguishes it from other games, be it a unique mechanic, a unique source of tension, a unique theme evocation, etc.

Good luck!

-Jeff

PS to David: Wallenstein's cube tower flawed!?! PM me and explain that to me; to my mind, it's probably the best randomizing combat resolution system in any game I've ever played...

phpbbadmin
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Ever feel like a copycat??

My approach to game design (disclaimer: I am not an expert, just passionate) is to look at the game as thematically as possible and then work 'top down' to 'zoom in' on the necessary mechanics necessary that work with the theme. Often times this method will lead me to conclude that the game I want to make just can't be done practically in a board game format. The game may take too long or it won't be possible to make entertaining within the constraints of a 'board game world'. However, the beauty of this method is that you steer the design the way you want it to go, rather than trying to paste a theme onto a mechanic. Don't get me wrong, I don't feel like there's anything wrong with taking a strong mechanic and adding a theme to make it more palatable, I simply believe you won't fall into the trap of (feeling like you're) ripping off people's mechanics if you use the 'top down' approach.

I have said this a bunch, but I will say it again: 'There is nothing new under the sun.' Since we as designers do not live in a bubble, it's almost impossible to come up with something that is really 'new'. The best you can hope to do is vary an existing idea to some degree so that it produces something new and refreshing. That's the way our brains work; as creators of works and as consumers of works. Imagine this: Could a band like Metallica sell millions of records if they had existed in the 50 or 60s? No! To extend that even further, their particular brand of music would not even be possible. They needed to hear the bands that influenced them before they could produce the music they now do. The same holds true for games. I couldn't have come up with any of my ideas without people like Knizia, Jolly, and Kramer influencing my ideas.

One thing you may want to do is take a game with a theme you like and gameplay you didn't particularly like, then retool it into how you feel the game should play. Or take a game that you think is decent that has an aspect that really bugs you and retool that aspect. For instance, Scurra doesn't like the dice tower in Wallenstein. So if he felt inclined, he could come up with an alternate system for resolving combat.

I think the major aspect is to have fun! Your first few games *WILL* stink... And ideas you have that you thought were the 'be all end all' of game designs you realize are just so so. Game design, like anything else, is a progression. You won't hit a home run the first time at bat, but hopefully with some perserverence, you can raise your average after every attempt. =)

At any rate, welcome aboard! Glad to have you!
-Darke

Scurra
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Ever feel like a copycat??

Darkehorse wrote:
You won't hit a home run the first time at bat,

(I assume this is some sort of obscure American sporting reference*)

Shhhhh. Don't tell people that, you'll only discourage them :-)

--
David

(*to forestall any PMs etc, yes I do know what this is referring to. But it was too good a feed-line to ignore.)

phpbbadmin
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Ever feel like a copycat??

Scurra wrote:
Darkehorse wrote:
You won't hit a home run the first time at bat,

(I assume this is some sort of obscure American sporting reference*)

Shhhhh. Don't tell people that, you'll only discourage them :-)

--
David

(*to forestall any PMs etc, yes I do know what this is referring to. But it was too good a feed-line to ignore.)

You guys don't have home runs in Cricket?

-Darke

Scurra
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Ever feel like a copycat??

Darkehorse wrote:
You guys don't have home runs in Cricket?
ROFL. That quite made my evening.

Anonymous
Ever feel like a copycat??

Cricket is crazy.... you hit the ball, and run as fast as you can between two sticks. that is how you score. crazy brits :oops:

Anonymous
Ever feel like a copycat??

Arrrg! I always seem to enter into a thread late! So, as per usual, I can only echo the wisdom already given. In any creative endeavor, being absolutely original is next to impossible. It is best to pursue one's own interpretation of a concept, as others have stated, I believe it become more a matter of putting your own spin on something. A new adaptation.

It's like game evolution.

When coming up with game ideas I generally start with the "Groovy Idea." Whether it is a concept, theme, or a mechanic, I usually have that one thing that acts as the fuel to weave the flesh of the game together. Often the "flesh" is made up of tried-and-true, classic mechanics and some cannibalized concepts from my failed games.

Dralius
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Ever feel like a copycat??

Here is my sad but true story

In the late 90’s I developed a space combat game that had a simple and elegant way of keeping track of inertia and the space vehicles facing. The players needed no knowledge of higher math to do so, only requiring them you learn a simple 5 step system for checking their ship each turn after action was determined. Once a player was accustom to the system it only took a few seconds per step. I was quite proud of it but without a play group at the time it sat only half finished. Once I had found this group; I decided my first project would be to finish it. To my great dismay it was pointed out to me that there was a similar game. I looked up the rules and in some great joke of fate not only was it unbelievably similar but it predated my game by several years. So I moved on.

As a rule before I get exited about creating a game that is “unique” I search the BGG for any that use similar mechanics.

ensor
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Ever feel like a copycat??

For my 2 cents, using known mechanics is very valuable in learning about how games work. Too often, I try to make a whole game at once, and when I play it, things all fall apart. Instead, I think it's better to take one mechanic say card drafting, and try to make a simple game that works, seeing all the ins and outs of why players want this card instead of that. It seems like there should be little workbook exercises for beginning game designers: "Your homework today is to make a game with tiles.." that you can do before trying to make the next ubergame. Game design is a discipline that take practice just like anything else.

Mark

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