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Dice Mechanic - Stupid or Cool?

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 18:47
jbmoyer
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Hello, the game idea I am working on involves combat and currently how I am resolving combat is as follows. I feel stupid asking this but wanted to get your opinion.

Combat: Player rolls 5d6, for each 1 or 6 rolled they "hit" for each 4 that is rolled its "wild" and therefore a "hit". The number of "hits" lets say 2 were rolled, two 6's is compared to the enemy's "toughness" and for arguments sake lets say this enemy has a toughness of 2. Since the "hits" is equal to or greater the player wins.

Ideally I am going to have custom face dice over 1,2,3 etc.. but I plan on having 2 faces with "hits", 2 faces with "traps" and 1 and 1 other faces.

The Stupid (or not) Question: Am I really doing anything by some players rolling 3 dice vs another player rolling say 6 dice? Players dont fight each other, they fight an enemy which all have different toughness. Since they are all d6 isn't rolling 6d6 the same "odds" as rolling 1d6?

The combat sure PLAYS fun, but is throwing more dice into the mix really "doing" anything?

Thanks.

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 19:03
#1
questccg
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In another direction!

Well I think the dice rolling is cool - but to offset the fact that you believe it to be the SAME as rolling 1d6 vs. 6d6, I would add a DICE DRAFTING mechanic to the game...

Basically this would allow players to use some form of "upgrades" to either EARN (via experience) or BUY (via money) to their dice pool.

I'd also maybe consider using a COMMON dice pool so that players sort of compete against each other in the drafting mechanic. This is important because it puts players at odds with each other, even if the goal is not direct conflict.

The EARNING vs. BUYING is also cool, because you can have several different opportunities to get the dice you want. EARNING would upgrade certain specific dice like maybe 2 out of 6 and the four (4) remaining can be bought from the pool.

So this way it PLAYS fun and ADDS a modifier to ODDS with the various dice that can be bought.

But it's up to you to determine and think up the kind of dice you can BUY. Think of using colors for the various dice so maybe 6 or 8 different kinds of dice...

Would that make it MORE exciting than just rolling always the same identical 6d6s?!?! I think it adds another level which is cool because you can do all kinds of things with the dice and cards.

Best of luck with your game!

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 19:29
#2
questccg
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I know nothing...

I know nothing about your game... But if your game allows dividing the dice into "classes" (this is just a example).

So Fighter dice could be "Red" and they have like "3 Attack", "2 Miss" and "1 Special". So you would have 50% odds of hitting. The Fighter could have a rule that he can DRAFT three (3) of these dice to his 6 dice pool. IF you have a special ability like "Bezerker", the "Special" can be an "instant kill/critical hit"

A Mage dice could be "Green" and they have like "2 Spell", "3 Miss" and "1 Special". So the mage could use spells at a rate of 33%. He could have a rule that he can DRAFT two (2) of these dice to his 6 dice pool. IF you have a special ability like "Petrification", the "Special" can be an "instant stop" that can allow another player to defeat the creature.

This assumes that players behave like a party and are working together... Just an example... And some more idea...

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 19:49
#3
questccg
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There is a lot

If you think that a "standard" d6 could be like "1 Melee Attack", "1 Spell", "1 Ranged", etc... equal odds for each class (and you would therefore have 6 classes in your game).

So the "standard" dice is not very favorable. But there could be things like a "Fighter" could use a "scroll" if he rolls 2x Spells. Scrolls are exactly like Spells but can ONLY be used once. A Mage character can repeatedly use the scroll (and the card is not discarded). Again some more ideas you can play with...

I personally like dice game. And I think that 6d6 is the MAXIMUM of dice you can roll in one hand... So I would say that it's the limit (6). But I have heard of other designer claiming that some games use even MORE than six dice... :)

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 19:57
#4
jbmoyer
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well.....

Thanks for the input, I guess what I was wondering was if 1d6 was the same as 6d6, but don't think it matters, which sounds funny. But Martian dice uses a quantity of d6 and it works.

I like your last post some interesting tidbits in there. My game is essentially a dungeon crawl (like we need anymore of those) and you have a few heroes and I was thinking a Fighter is stronger then a Mage so a Mage would have like 2d6 vs a Fighter with 6d6.

In odds I don't think the fighter has better odds, but it feels like he does and maybe all that matters. For example the Mage can only roll 2 1's or 2 6's, but the Fighter can roll 6 or either.

I do like the last bit on doing something like 2 of a kind or 3 of a kind and trading for a Scroll or something. That could be an interesting twist, make the player think do I want 4 hits or 1 scroll of KILL EVERYTHING and 1 hit.....hmmmmmm

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 20:23
#5
questccg
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Hehehe

jbmoyer wrote:
...In odds I don't think the fighter has better odds, but it feels like he does and maybe all that matters. For example the Mage can only roll 2 1's or 2 6's, but the Fighter can roll 6 or either...

Well where I think it matters is when fighting STRONGER opponents. It may take 3 1's or 3 6's and a Mage can only roll 2. So to defeat a stronger opponent he will need to resort to magic/spells (for example). Or maybe a Magical Ring of Strength which adds +1 1... Or something like that.

Believe me, I never get tired of the D&D, Dungeon Crawl games... In my book there is always place for YET another one! And with a bunch of dice my bet it will probably be better than "Dungeon Roll" and that game made a HUGE amount of bucks: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/michaelmindes/dungeon-roll-a-dicey-...

I wouldn't say NO to $250,070!!! Hehehe...

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 20:39
#6
jbmoyer
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Exactly...$$$

Your right if ppl buy it then who says there's not room. I actually have that game.

Actually your prior posts got me thinking on how I could change it up so it had more "strategy" in how "hits" are calculated. What about if instead of "x hits rolled" to more of "x of a kind"?

Example:
d6, Custom dice faces, 2 Sword, 2 Starburst, 1 Wave, 1 Shield - something like that

You need to roll one or more combinations “of a kind” to make a successful hit on a creature

Example: to hit a Skeleton you need to roll 4 Swords or 2 Starburst and 1 Shield
This way a more squishy hero with 3d6 could hit the Skeleton, assuming 2 and 1 of a kind is better odds then 3 of a kind and certainly better then 4 of a kind which they couldn't hit with only 3d6. Doing this also gives the player the option to send in a squishy hero where previously he wouldn't have risked it and would have sent in a hero with 4d6 or better.
Although this technically makes it "easier" for high d6 heroes to score a hit. Maybe adding a "primary" type to each hero, like a Fighter's primary is the Sword, so if he is fighting a creature with a "of a kind" of Swords he must roll that to hit. Vs a Mage could rol the 4 Swords or the 2 and 1. Also to solidify that making the primary's on a create be the same "x of a kind". hmmmm this is getting interesting....
Heroes still have a quantity of d6 which are combined for attacking

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 21:28
#7
questccg
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I don't mind

I don't mind adding some ideas and suggestions because those games are not ones that I am focused on designing.

My roster includes my Work-In-Progress which is a Deck-Building/Roles Sci-Fi card game, a WWII sim (which I would like to work on - but cannot find the effort/time to do it) and a "sort of dungeon crawler" that has it's own set of elements/mechanics which are unique (such as analog movement).

I also have a Android Video game project - I should find the time to work on... I have been neglecting that project. I will work on it tomorrow! :)

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 21:58
#8
questccg
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More options...

Like a RED dice could have 2x ONE Melee Hit, 1x TWO Melee Hits, 2x Blank (nothing) and 1x Special. So odds of doing melee damage with the RED dice are 50%.

Yes I agree rolling more of a TYPE (like a sword or two-swords) as in two, three or four of a kind is what I was hinting at.

And you could indicate on the Skeleton card 3x Sword or 2x Starburst.

You could maybe streamline it and have three (3) types of ATTACK: Sword (Melee), Arrow (Ranged) and Starburst (Magic).

RED dice could be for better attack and BLUE dice could be for defense (like "1x 2 Shields, 3x 1 Shield and 2x Blank")... So you would draft a BLUE dice to protect yourself from a creatures counter attack - IF your dice roll is unsuccessful!

Update: BLANK on the RED dice is like a PENALTY = Your odds a BETTER BUT there is also a possibility of rolling NOTHING! So the standard d6 might be better/safer in risky situations...

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Sat, 05/09/2015 - 23:32
#9
Soulfinger
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jbmoyer wrote:The Stupid (or

jbmoyer wrote:
The Stupid (or not) Question: Am I really doing anything by some players rolling 3 dice vs another player rolling say 6 dice? Players dont fight each other, they fight an enemy which all have different toughness. Since they are all d6 isn't rolling 6d6 the same "odds" as rolling 1d6?

The combat sure PLAYS fun, but is throwing more dice into the mix really "doing" anything?

If I understand you right, a player hits on a roll of 1,4, or 6 on a d6, so a single die has a 50% chance of inflicting a hit. A person rolling 3 dice therefore has an 87.5% chance of hitting, whereas a person rolling 6 dice has a 98.4% chance. More importantly, the more dice that a player has, the greater the chance of scoring additional successes to defeat the target toughness threshold.

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Sun, 05/10/2015 - 04:01
#10
X3M
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Soulfinger wrote: If I

Soulfinger wrote:

If I understand you right, a player hits on a roll of 1,4, or 6 on a d6, so a single die has a 50% chance of inflicting a hit. A person rolling 3 dice therefore has an 87.5% chance of hitting, whereas a person rolling 6 dice has a 98.4% chance. More importantly, the more dice that a player has, the greater the chance of scoring additional successes to defeat the target toughness threshold.

He compares the number of hits.
So the chance for one hit doesn't really matter, unless the soldier faces an opponent where only one hit is needed. Then it is 87,5% indeed.

@ jbmoyer
Perhaps when you have an idea worked out. You could compare all the players. And see how much chance they have in defeating an opponent.
If they have an upgrade curve or earning curve. You can make this in a table as well.
This table will give you already a good view of how the game might progress.

If you do not know how. You can always ask for help on this forum.

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Sun, 05/10/2015 - 08:59
#11
debiant
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Having additional dice is

Having additional dice is almost always a good thing. a Single die doesn't give a curve of success to failure like multiple dice as the chance to hit on any single die will always be 50%. This is a very similar system that used in Arkham Horror and several other FFG games. If you were to have the other die faces do something different, as mentioned previously, that could be interesting.

So, do the enemy take hits regardless of whether you reach the threshold number or just if you hit the threshold number?

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Sun, 05/10/2015 - 11:08
#12
jbmoyer
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Great information..

Thank you all this has been helpful. The original idea was to have say the Fighter roll 6d6 and for each 1, 4, 6 rolled its a hit. say he rolled 2 1's compare the to the toughness of an enemy, toughness of 2, the fighter hits. the 4 is Wild, but your likely going to use it as a hit.

Looking at changing over to a "of a kind" method. need to play and see how it feels. I think there is more depth to this method, but I have to tell you the couple of play through s I did with the first method were very exciting, it was very hard to get 2 or 3 1,4,6.

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