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Does Pitching Minis Hurt Publication Chances?

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 20:49
Rangerlab
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Hey guys, so I'm working on a Strategy Board Game semi-inspired by MOBAs, and I'm probably going to try going through a publisher. I'd love for it to use minis, but is that up for me to decide? And if so, will it hurt the prospect of the game?

I assume that not many publishers would want a first time designer, much less one who wants minis in their game, but would I mention it in the pitch? Or should I mention it at all? There's 36 champions in the game (not including possible expansions (assuming it actually does well)), though it might be hard to tell the two teams apart, so possibly 72 figures with different colored bases? It might be best to use stands and have 32 pieces to put in, but again, would that be up to me to decide?

Thanks for reading this, I appreciate the help!

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 20:56
#1
I Will Never Gr...
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You pitch the hook for your

You pitch the hook for your game, how it plays, how you envision it looking and feeling and then the publisher will decide everything.

If they sign your game they will figure out the best way to move forward. Chances are you will have very little input at that point.

Some games dont even resemble the initial pitch by the time they are released.

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 20:59
#2
I Will Never Gr...
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With that in mind, some

With that in mind, some publishers wont even look at games with minis while others love them. Know the publisher you are pitching first

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 21:04
#3
questccg
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Woah re-think your strategy

I have been also discussing/thinking about "minis" for my 3rd Expansion of my game "Tradewars - Homeworld". Basically we would ADD a "Tactical" layer on top of the existing game.

But I'm thinking about things like: 6 minis per box set.

32?!?! Seriously. I guess you don't know how expensive the molds are. But then again this guy did it:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/loka-the-world-of-fantas...

Notice THIS GUY is SMART: 8 pieces (including 4 pawns) for $15.00. What this means is if you want to play the game with all pieces, it's going to cost you DOUBLE ($30.00) for 16 pieces.

What you should explore is duplicates of pieces. This could help lower the cost of the "minis" like Mr. Loka did for pawns.

Notice that 18 pieces cost $50.00 (Painted I believe - not 100% certain what 3-Color Finish is (and it's Trademarked)).

Anyhow - see if you can reduce the COST of "minis". As far as I understand the Artist's price for clay sculpts or rendered files is $250-$300 for EACH mini. 32 x $250 = $8,000 and still no molds. I don't think anyone will want to publish at that cost.

Just my observations and comments.

Good luck with your game!

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 21:09
#4
questccg
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Also check out this thread

http://www.bgdf.com/forum/game-creation/publication/cost-freelance-minia...

It also deals with "minis"... Some more information and another thread link to more examples...

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 21:10
#5
Rangerlab
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Thanks guys :D

Thanks guys, didn't think I'd get responses so fast. I probably should have read a post or two about pitching a game first, lol, but oh well. Yeah, I knew it wasn't exactly a realistic idea, but I suppose it's better to dream too big than to dream too small.

Thanks again guys!

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 21:35
#6
questccg
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Budgets are a CONCERN

Rangerlab wrote:
I probably should have read a post or two about pitching a game first, lol, but oh well.

Well IF you want to design a game that will be "publishable" you need to remember that COST to produce is important. For example in my WIP "Tradewars - Homeworld" (TWHW) my artwork is costing me $6,000 USD. This is double to what some publisher have said an artwork budget should be (around $3,000 USD). But for me, I want my product to have the artist I have started working with - and no way is he going to accept HALF the amount...

Just an example of why some people decide to crowdfund: I want players to enjoy playing the game - and I want to design expansions for the game to add more strategy and different game play. But I want the game to look as good as it can be (also)!

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Wed, 12/02/2015 - 23:57
#7
radioactivemouse
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about minis...

Ultimately, your game should work well without minis.

Not having minis should be the litmus test of your game. If the game is fun without mini's the game is good. The minis should only be icing on the cake.

Game companies aren't dumb. They can see if you've embellished your game with fancy minis...even if you just mention it to them.

If you're a first time designer, make a good game. Minis should be the last thing on your mind.

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Fri, 12/04/2015 - 13:15
#8
Soulfinger
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questccg wrote:Notice THIS

questccg wrote:
Notice THIS GUY is SMART: 8 pieces (including 4 pawns) for $15.00. What this means is if you want to play the game with all pieces, it's going to cost you DOUBLE ($30.00) for 16 pieces.

Not sure I'd characterize Mantic as a "guy," so much as one of the larger miniature manufacturers competing with Games Workshop for the tabletop wargame market. The designer of this particular game, Alessio Cavatore, is also very well known within the industry, so he can pitch a game with just about any number of minis in it.

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Fri, 12/04/2015 - 13:51
#9
Soulfinger
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radioactivemouse

radioactivemouse wrote:
Ultimately, your game should work well without minis.

Not having minis should be the litmus test of your game. If the game is fun without mini's the game is good. The minis should only be icing on the cake.

Game companies aren't dumb. They can see if you've embellished your game with fancy minis...even if you just mention it to them.

If you're a first time designer, make a good game. Minis should be the last thing on your mind.

That is some excellent advice.

I would add that name recognition plays a big role when it comes to miniature companies launching new lines. Players tend to gravitate toward titles that parallel OOP GW properties, like Mordheim/Necromunda, Bloodbowl, and Battlefleet Gothic. "It's like X" is a big selling point for the tabletop equivalents of the MOBA games that inspire you, so you end up with titles like Osprey's Frostgrave, CoolMiniorNot's Kaosball, and Hawk Wargame's Dropfleet Commander.

Out of those examples, only Frostgrave's author doesn't have substantial industry experience -- although he has been published before, this is his second title with the publisher, and there is no associated miniature line. The other games are authored by Eric Lang and Andy Chambers, both well-established designers (Andy Chambers is to wargames what Reiner Knizia is to board games). The market is flush and extremely competitive. Even companies that specialize in miniature skirmish games, like Wyrd, will end up using standees in a board game offering, like Darkness Comes Rattling.

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