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Dungeon Crawl - Devils Advocate (not game title)

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jbmoyer
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Joined: 04/27/2012

So I wanted to play some devils advocate and see what everyone is thinking. I like many of you enjoy a good Dungeon Crawl/Good Dungeon Fantasy game. My problem and yours as well possibly, is that it is hard to get together with a friend(s) to play, so therefore we default to Solo play which is quite fun actually.

I have been working on a solo dungeon crawl. Been reading the many many posts here and on BGG among other resources. I feel I have a decent game, but really want to not make it a hack n slash, but really how can you do that in a Dungeon Crawl let alone a Solo one?

So here comes the devils advocate. Why even make ANOTHER dungeon crawl game? Sure mine will be the best one ever "not" and the graphics with be one of a kind "not". I do enjoy just creating and surely that is why I do it and I am sure you as well. But honestly we really have to be doing it for fun, because the likelihood of getting published and becoming the next Heros Quest is unlikely right?

Well what are you thoughts, would really enjoy hearing them. This post is party due to the fact that I am somewhat burnt-out on the game, don't want to just make another go in a dungeon, kill stuff and then kill more stuff, but that is what Dungeon Crawls are aren't they?

Thanks
Brett

JustActCasual
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Joined: 11/20/2012
Well, if what you're looking

Well, if what you're looking for is a way to create a solo dungeon crawl with a heavy narrative aspect, you really want an element to randomly interact with a story you're telling. You could use a device like Story Cubes to create random cues (even make your own "Dungeon cubes"). You could use something like a scene resolution system to give just enough guidance but still leave you to figure out the details. You could use a random character generation system to help avoid character tropes you frequently explore. You could retheme the dungeon crawl to emphasize different aspects (think heavy stealth mechanics, or maybe you're an archer and need to continually find cover and line up perfect shots, or maybe you drastically retheme to a 'political' dungeon crawl where you need to beat various charisma challenges rather than swording things). Or you could do any combination of the above.

Really you want to look at the core reasons the dungeon crawl appeals to you, strip away all the rest, and see if you can find ways to play up what you have left. You're designing your game for you. What do YOU WANT to do?

Pinbot
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Joined: 09/11/2012
Surely a non-hack 'n' slash

Surely a non-hack 'n' slash solo adventure is a gamebook? Google them up; Steve Jackson's ones are great fun.

Sperber
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Joined: 03/22/2011
Let me be an advocate too

Devils Advocate nails it. I really, really don't like dungeon crawlers. I played some Hero and Star Quest back in the day but somehow that whole genre lost all my interest. So let me be a devils advocate too and let me defend the accused.

If you look at the history of dungeon crawl games I would say that they were simply visual representations of early roleplaying games. I still have my first D&D box: the red one. It was all about 'draw a dungeon, fill it with monsters, traps and treasures and let the heroes have a go at it!' And that is pretty much how we played it. Then I saw Hero Quest and that game is all about 'build a dungeon filled with monsters, traps and treasures and let the heroes have a go at it!'

But roleplaying developed. New games popped up like White Wolfs World of Darkness which first put the emphasis on narrating and storytelling. That never stopped. Roleplaying games kept developing. We have games with no dungeon master in which all players contribute to that part and we have games like Warhammer Fantasy 3rd Edition that actually uses a lot of board game mechanisms.

So, the assumption that a dungeon crawler is just all about hack n slash is a little outdated and archaic in my opinion. I can't see why dungeon crawlers shouldn't evolve too. And one game that has done a wonderfull job doing that is Mansions of Madness. Of course here is still monster slaying in the game but it is not the main goal anymore. What I believe would perfectly fit in a solo game is the puzzle mechanism of MoM. If you don't know it I propose you check it out because I can easily see that something like this could be the heart of a non hack n slay solo dungeon crawler game. Just shift the player's task from killing stuff to problem solving.
Of course that doesn't mean that there shouldn't be any fighting at all.

jbmoyer wrote:
But honestly we really have to be doing it for fun, because the likelihood of getting published and becoming the next Heros Quest is unlikely right?

Yes, that is unlikely. Unless your game has a unique twist. Mice and Mystiques for example has its very unusuable and enjoyable theme (and there you have the only two dungeon crawlers I enjoy: MoM and M&M. So you should use the letter M in your game twice and I will most likely play it.) If you just create another stereotypical dungeon crawler the chances of it getting publishes are slim and you should be content to play it with your friends and family. If on the other hand you manage to give your game something unique I don't see why it shpuldn't have the same chance as any other game. As long as it is good of course.

jbmoyer
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Joined: 04/27/2012
Really Great Insights

Thank you all those are some really great insights. I like the idea of story cubes and scene resolution system will look into those that would be interesting in a solo dungeon, thanks JustActCasual. and Sperber I was totally thinking of naming it MM, so I guess I can count you in for one sale, just have to price it high enough to retire, start saving. I have been thinking of how I can implement puzzle mechanics and will for sure look into Mansions of Madness, thank you.

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